The Next President of USA

Friends, these are the prophecy spoken by Prophet Kim Clement concerning the next President of United Stated. Read carefully, and ask Holy Spirit for guidance.

February 10, 2007-Scottsdale, AZ

God’s Spirit says, I’m waiting, I’m waiting for the response from My people throughout this land. Can somebody see victory? Can somebody see honor? For God says, let Me remind you I will place at your helm a President that shall pray to Me, says the Lord. He will pray to Me. And God says, in the next two terms there will be a praying President, not a religious one, for I will fool the people, says the Lord. I will fool the people, yes I will. God says, the one that is chosen shall go in and they shall say, he has hot blood. For the Spirit God says, yes he may have hot blood, but he will bring the walls of protection on this country in a greater way and the economy of this country shall change rapidly, says the Lord of Hosts. God says, I will put at your helm for two terms a President that will pray but he will not be a praying President when he starts. I will put him in Office and then I will baptize him with the Holy Spirit and My power, says the Lord of Hosts……

April 4, 2007-Redding, CA

The Spirit of the Lord says, hear the Word of the Lord tonight: this Nation has waited and waited and they have said, revival, revival, revival. God said, there is more than revival. We have revived and brought back but a spirit of resurrection is upon you. For God said, I am breathing, I am breathing upon the people of this Nation. I am breathing upon the churches that are going down and I am bringing them up, says the Spirit of God. I am breathing upon the political powers that be. For God said, I will not forget 911. I will not forget what took place that day and I will not forget the gatekeeper that watched over New York who will once again stand and watch over this Nation, says the Spirit of God. It shall come to pass that the man that I place in the highest office shall go in whispering My name. But God said, when he enters into the office he will be shouting out by the power of the Spirit for I shall fill him with My Spirit when he goes into office and there will be a praying man in the highest seat in your land. And God says, even a greater move of the Spirit shall take place and your enemies will finally be subdued by the year 2009…..

June 17, 2007-San Jose, CA

God says a President that I will bring into the White House they will say he is ungodly, he does not know God. Even as Jesus disguised himself for the great feasts, so I’ve disguised this man’s heart. When he comes to the White House not only shall he be Mine but he shall pray as a man that has never prayed in the White House. That same man shall put his feet onto this platform. They will say how did this take place? Laws shall change. Young men and young women will have access into the kingdom and with authority into politics and with authority into the industries that now have been controlled by darkness because of this man that shall rule for two terms. Do not fear there will be no unnecessary stuff. There will be things that men shall question. Fear not for he shall sit in that seat and suddenly My Spirit shall come upon him and baptize him with a fire and with anointing says the Spirit of the Lord. No more war. The time for war has gone. The time for Peace has come. The House that you call White shall receive a man, a knight, who fought for you in your nights…..

October 5, 2007-Seattle, WA

Pray, pray, pray for America. Smile saints, smile for 2008 for who I place in your White House shall know the Spirit of God in a way. A very unique thing I will do, I told you before, there will be joy and celebration for the man I place in the White House shall not be filled with My Spirit when he goes in but when he settles down I will baptize him with fire and the Holy Spirit. Pray, pray, pray for America. The land of the brave, the land of the free, the Spirit shall be free…….

October 19, 2007-Fredrick, MD

From the soil comes the sound of martyrs in the ground. In vain, no, no, no. From the sound I hear the prayers of those in pain. Will My blood save this nation? The death of one who gave his life on the soil; not in vain for they will see what I will do in 2008, I’ll open the gate. I’ll send you the one that will watch over the nation just like he did when New York came apart; I sent a man that would stand the ground. You’ll hear the sound of a child in the White House because I’ll open the door. I’ve opened a door that no man can shut. I will laugh at your enemies. As I raise your children up, they will come into the presence of the Lord. I will laugh at your enemies for in the White House I will place prayer will be his delight, America’s might. When prayer becomes your delight, that’s when America will no longer fight……..

November 18, 2007

America you are at a place now where men are laughing, but God says the greatest place ever. The greatest opportunity has been granted now for Me to invade the media and to show you how when you choose My president. I will place a man there that shall have no inclination towards spiritual things and many a Christian shall say alas we have a Democrat who is actually a Republican. God says fear not for it shall be a while and then in the seat I will take him and fill him with My Spirit. He shall rise to the occasion and begin to pray and peace shall come to this nation, respect and honor shall come to this nation. A move of My Spirit as this nation has never seen for the harvest you have been waiting for shall come.

From the entire prophetic message above, we can recognize the person that Prophet Kim Clement mean about. Yes, Mr. Rudy Giuliani former Major of New York City. So, we need to pray and pray and pray …


Next President of United Stated of America


427 Responses

  1. the war yes the wars what is going on with this world the time is ending day by day realize that,the words of the bible are coming true.

  2. president i wish you the best for your new goal of becoming some really responsible,what ever happens let God take the control of we could win all wars prayp ill pray for you and this whole world.castle.

  3. You will have great responsibility now Mr. President and we are praying for you. Listen to God and do what he says without question and he will make you a mighty leader. God Bless the USA

  4. Giuliani has dropped out of the race. Now what?

  5. You need to get into Kim Clement’s secret vault at his website to read other recent prophecies.

    I believe what he’s prophecying is that McCain is going to win, and Rudy is going to be his Vice President. A recent prophecy from a few weeks ago said something about the Vice president ending up as the actual leader…. McCain is kind of old… I’ll leave it as that.

    Or maybe Obama ends up winning and picks Rudy as his VP…. who knows….

  6. @ DLB

    Easy bro’ keep on praying … stay aware for the election …

    @ David

    Thanks bro’ for your info. Yea, we need to keep on alert …

    God Bless all …

  7. Kim Clement prophesied in July 1998, and again on March 2, 2002, that, there would be an African American president of the U.S.A.

    A line from the Nov. 18, 07 prophecy reads: many a christian shall say, alas, we have a Democrat (Obama)who is actually a Republican.

    An Obama / Giuliani ticket crossed my mind as well.

  8. The correct date of that prophecy is March 5, 2002. The July,1998 prophecy was given at Without Walls Church in Tampa, Florida. I was there, and I have the tape.

  9. Thank’s a lot Corolyn, that’s a great info.

    Well if you had the tape, would you main to write down (not all just…) the prophecy that Kim Clement said about there would be an African American president of the U.S.A.

  10. Here is the portion of the prophecy that you requested.

    Lift up your hands. I feel the liberty to prophesy this. Keep going, pray. For the Spirit of the Lord say’s,’ There shall be in the new millenium, an African- American president of the United States of America. God says, many will hate you,for even agreeing in saying this, but, I have chosen and designated it for the new millenium. God says, It will cause a massive stirring, a division that will cause me to come upon my church, and the kingdom shall arise,for the man that I put in the White House, says the Lord, shall be a spirit- filled man that knows the Lord, and knows of his greatness, and knows of his goodness, says the Lord.
    They will- – – – – – , but I will protect him says the Lord, for
    this man, have I raised up for righteousness sake, says the Lord, in the United States of America, for the world, says the Lord.

    • Just more proof that Kim Clement was a false prophet by biblical standards……search it out without the blinders on…..its now 2017…………Obama has made such a mess of the USA…….and he is a Muslim..and he is gay. …he has divided our country to the point of almost racial wr….he has NOT become a Spirit filled president………..we need to stop using this man’s prophecies… is a mockery of what the true people of YHWH are all about………YHWH is shutting down the false prophets……I have absolutely no bitterness toward Kim Clement as a person, but, his prophecies are repeatedly wrong, and his prophecies must be judged by the Word of the Creator.

  11. Rudi? You got to be kidding me! Could McCain pick Rudi as his running mate… Rudi already dropped out. What about Mike Huckubee? Wouldn’t he make a good president?

  12. I chose to use dashes in the place of the words that I did not feel free to write, due to the fact that Kim has
    removed this prophecy from his website for the reason
    that he states on his website.

  13. Vote for Mike Huckabee. I know he is a long shot, but it sure would be neat to see him win. I am guessing McCain will win and then maybe pick Huckabee as Vice President, but who knows – Long Shots do happen everyonce in awhile. Look at the Giants beating the Patrios, who would have thought?

  14. I like Mike Huckabee. I voted for him in my state primary, but if John McCain gets the republican nomination, and Obama gets the democratic nomination, I’m going to consider voting for Barak Obama.
    Continue to watch and pray.

  15. @ Timothy Shields
    Thanks bro’ Timothy for your comment but we actually try to listen who God choose to be the next president … Is not about good or bad. Bless you.

    By the way, I support your wedding. Hopefully I can come and join.

    @ Carolyn Snow
    Yes, is ok we understand how important this prophecy to keep in secret but thanks, is time to others can read and understand more to pray for this coming election.

    God Bless you, Carolyn. Keep watch …

  16. I believe that Kim is a true prophet. He knows who the next president is. Why doesn’t he just say it plainly to the church. I mean the prophets of old did that many times. Or am I missing something?

  17. Kim says that he is not allowed to tell us who the next president is because of the non-profit status that his ministry operates under.

  18. It has to be McCain or Obama because the prophecies refer to the next president as a he\him. You’ll hear the sound of a child in the White House because I’ll open the door…sounds like Obama. He has two young daughters.

  19. A certain prophet named Stephen Odonga has prophesied that the next US president will be Senator Obama. This prophet has been accurate in his prophecies I checked his site at

  20. Friends why is it that Prophet Kim is always prophesying peace and prosperity and so unlike the prophets of old in the nature of his prophetic utterance? I’m not saying this out of a critical heart but out of a heart that seeks understanding. Most of the old prophets including Agabus the new testament prophet predicted disaster and trouble. Can anyone please explain to me clearly from scripture? Thank you.

  21. Kim, thanks for that information. I just went to that website and found the prophecy listed under news.I have never heard of this prophet. It looks like he is from the U.K.

  22. Snow, I don’t understand what you mean by Prophet Kim not being able to tell us who the next president is because of that status. I mean he prophesied about George Bush before he became president. Please explain. Thanks.

  23. Please see the prophetic perspectives posted by Hank Kunneman. Visit his website He is perhaps one of the most accurate prophets I know. He will shed more light on this. It is unfortunate he has removed previous postings for the past years but everything he said about the last 2 elections were right on the money.

  24. Kim, it has to do with the seperation of church and state. Church leaders cannot tell the people who to vote for. To prophesy the name of the next president would be like telling the people who to vote for…..K.C. prophecied Bush as president prior to the Sept. 11 attacks on America. It’s not the thing to do in this day and time. I hope this helps you to understand. God bless you !

  25. Snow thank you for explaining. I get you. Hey have you read any prophecies by Kim Clement which failed to happened and if you have how do you react to that? I just don’t know how to react sometimes.

  26. Sanofi, thank you so much for that timely input. I went to the website then tuned into T.B.N. last night to hear what God had to say through Kunneman. We want Gods choice for president in Gods time.

  27. We want Gods choice for president in Gods time…..the one that is chosen, shall go in and they shall say, he has hot blood. Yes, he may have hot blood, but he will bring the walls of protection on this country in a greater way and the economy of this country shall change rapidly, says the Lord of Hosts.

  28. Kim, I am praying about how to answer your question. Jesus loves you very much.

  29. See the first prophecy posted above by Kingthunder that came through Kim Clement on Feb. 10, 2007 in Scottsdale, Arizona.

  30. Thank you very much Snow for all you say to help me. I truly appreciate it. I’ll be expecting to hear your answer soon. I truly just seek to understand. Thing is I look up to Kim Clement a lot when it comes to prophetic ministry since I myself love to operate in the prophetic. So when Kim Clement makes a false prediction I don’t know how to react to that and how to trust what he says afterwards.

  31. Sorry, folks, but this has to be some of the worst gobble gook I have read in years. It doesn’t take a prophet to tell us where we are on the timeline of history, though I believe in the office of a TRUE prophet; get into the Word of God and read what happened to Israel, when they continued to sin and became more evil than the nations around them.
    Case and point: How could God Almighty bless a nation who continues to shed innocent blood and think that judgment will not come to them?
    I do not have credentials to present to tell you that prophets like Kim Clement are wrong—dead wrong—but I still have the right, in United States of America, to say I heard the voice of Almighty God–profound and precise in April of 2001–and HIs spoken Word was: “Son of man, when the land sinneth against me by trespassing grievously, then will I stretch out mine hand upon it, and will break the staff of the bread thereof, and send famine upon it, and will cut off man and beast from it.”
    Sorry, I don’t hear the prophetic word of peace and prosperity. I stand against prophets who declare that to be true. And, does one really NEED to be reminded that if a prophet declares something falsely–then GOD DID NOT SAY IT? God does work in precentages–HE IS ONE HUNDRED PERCENT ACCURATE–that IS THE MARK OF TRUE PROPHESY! How many times does one let these “guys of the hook” with their fast talking excuses?
    The war in Iraq is daily proof that the Lord can and will make United States the tail and not the head. I maintain that judgment is at our door. However, it seems the prophetic word hunters, only want to know who is going to win the election! Hmmmm. But then Jesus didn’t have one good word to say about
    the Laodician Church–a truly “clueless” body of believers. “He who hath an ear let him hear what THE SPIRIT is saying unto the Churches….”


    “God does NOT work in percentages….”

  33. Cheryl. Why do you find it hard for the gracious Christ to bless a sinful nation? Didn’t Jesus go about Jerusalem and heal and do good to them even though they were very sinful and rejected him? My point is that you can’t compare prophecy under the harsh Law and prophecy under Grace! Take note of the very definition of the word Grace; undeserved favour. I’m not saying God doesn’t judge sin but he doesn’t work through the harsh Law anymore. If Jesus showed such grace even before He died for us how much more now that His blood is sprinkled on the MERCY SEAT! Yes judgement will come upon America and in fact is already happening at specific places but it’s not for us to decide when, where or who God should judge! Remember these words; I will have mercy upon whom I will have mercy.

  34. Cheryl. You say you don’t hear prophecy of good and prosperity. Well Acts says Jesus went about doing GOOD. So I guess his disciples ought to do likewise. Not that they shouldn’t confront sin. But let’s be quick to bless and do good and slow to judge and be angry with. Be like Jesus. See how much grace he showed to sinful men throughout the gospels! It’s funny how people criticize Kim Clement so much for showing unusual grace! Remember what the teachers of the Law said about Christ when a sinful woman anointed Him? Watch out that you don’t end up with that same spirit. Jesus came to save not condemn anymore!

  35. Isaiah 60 reminds us that when gross darkness covers the land that is when we are told to arise and shine because the Glory of God is shinning on us. Could it be that the church’s best days are upon us?

  36. Cheryl. Jesus said we are the light of the world and ought to shine. How? Well He said: Let your light so shine that men may see your GOOD works and glorify your father who is in heaven.

  37. Cheryl. Please give me only two names of modern day prophets who prophesy correctly and 100% accurate according to you. Please. I would like to know and hear of their prophetic ministry. Please. I mean it sincerely.

    • Tb Joshua of the Synagogue Church of all Nations in Lagos Nigeria. You can watch him on A Gospel channel called emmanuel Tv, You Tube and on Facebook account-TB Joshua Ministries

  38. I have read my posting again and again and I do not find the word “good” in it, therefore, I find all the comments regarding my seeming attack on “good” to be incredibly confusing–as a result–no comment.
    However,I would like to thank the person who posted the website information of: Bless, whomever, for taking the time to do so.
    Lastly, Kim. I believe in your sincerity about a prophetic ministry.
    Do I know such a person? No. Do they exist? Yes, but I in turn “question” why one seeks them out.
    Personally, I find the work of David Wilkerson a source of comfort and validation, especially regarding the subject of, Christ Rock Music. I recommend the reading of his book: “Set The Trumpet To My Mouth” to all my Bible Classes and do the same for you.
    In closing, I will not be visiting this website again. Perhaps I was a bit rash in posting, what is in truth, a very precious insight given to me by The Lord, which I hold dear to my heart. It’s just that I had spent the day researching, Kim Clement, and “his work” due to a question raised by a younger disciple which the Lord has placed in my care—along with a learned Pastor, and Church Body, and in so doing wanted to go on public record regarding my personal opinion, therefore, concern. My response to this research is posted above.
    In closing, a very timely sermon to listen to, preached by David Wilkerson at Times Square Church in the spring of 2002 is: “The Towers Have Fallen But We Missed The Message”—-Charles Stanley preached a sermon very similar in content. I personally stand with these Brothers regarding every word they spoke in these sermons. Blessings, Cheryl

  39. Why wouldn’t there be an interest in this site? I mean, it is an election year. Those of us who are interested in the prophetic : Where did that interest come from? It was He who gave some to be apostles, some to be prophets, some to be evangelists, and some to be pastors and teachers, to prepare God’s people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ. Don’t be discouraged! My sheep listen to My voice; I know them and they follow me. We know that Jesus is first in our hearts. We love him first and foremost..

  40. Kim, Let me just say this. We need to pray for Kim, his family, his team,and the ministry of PIE. I don’t believe that we are deceived. I believe that God divinely connects certain people to certain ministries.
    I’ve been to Kim’s meetings, and I have listened to Kim long enough to know that Kim loves the Lord his God with all of his heart and with all of his soul and with all of his mind. No doubt about it ! Out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.
    I admire the beautiful relationship that Kim has with Jesus, and I so appreciate the atmosphere of intimate,prophetic worship that he creates. He is so passionate in his love for the Christ, and he takes us all to that place beyond the veil.
    He is not God. He is a man. I know that he’s been spoken against, and that, he has been attacked many times in his walk with the Lord; and I don’t believe that God is pleased with all these voices that are coming against him. There have been times in the past, where I would have to go to God with the claims that were being made against him, and with the thoughts of my being deceived by a false prophet.
    But, God has let me know that He has raised Kim up for such a time as this. I am to support him with my prayers. Kim has a unique way of prophesying, unlike any other. But it’s God’s voice, through God’s choise of expression,in a way, that can only come through Kim Clement.
    God bless you ! Kim Clement. I pray that God meets your every need – NOW – in Jesus name.

  41. Kingthunder…. It looks as if we have taken this to a place, that I am sure you did not want it to go; so I apologize in behalf of us all.

  42. I would like to see Huckabee become the vice president, and maybe the president eventually.; If abortion becomes a big issue later on this year, (due to something like the movie Horton hears a Who) and Christians lobby for him, McCain may take him. But it’ll take God’s intervention in his heart to pick him–he’s not his choice now. James

  43. @ C. Snow
    Thanks Carolyn, is ok ….. I understand that we all desire for the best thing happen in the coming election. I am glad that we hv the same passion to hear what the Spirit said concerning our next president.

    Again thx guys for all the comment, and remember to pray and not lose focus.

    Feel free to us this blog as a place of sharing. GBU all ……………………

  44. Kim……Read these words taken from Kim Clement’s book , ” CALL ME CRAZY but I’m hearing GOD ” : On page 89 , Kim says , There are times when some of my predictions have not come to pass and appear to be wrong , and for this I can only judge myself . However, it’s a tragic misunderstanding to believe that God will only speak to us when we are perfect and that a prophet cannot make any mistakes……. A prophet should have a track record of accuracy backing there words , but perfection is not required to be a voice for God. The source is complete , but the voice that is chosen to communicate the word is merely human …….The important thing to remember is that God is never wrong and that everyone must acknowledge their own imperfections before him …….Because I know this is true , I will never stop prophesying , for I know this is what God has called me to do , though I will always remain accountable to my friends and counselors. I will always endeavor to obey God as best I can, for my desire is to reach out to people from a heart of love and compassion.

    Kim , You are precious in God’s sight . He loves you so much . I love you too , and I’m praying for you . God bless…..

  45. Thanks a lot Snow.

  46. Not to change the subject but Kim has been prophesying that the Burning Bush will be vindicated before he leaves office. The day JP Morgan acquired Bears Stearns, I heard in my spirit that the bear is dead and since then the Market has overall remained in positive territories. Kim also mentioned that the new Fed chairman will be be good for our economy. With things getting better in Iraq, I will like to believe tha our finest days are ahead. It wasn’t coincident that the same day Bears Stearns went under, Hank Kunneman was on TBN prophesying that things would get better.

  47. Please look to the prophecy of July 2002, and realize that the man prophesied about on that date is Jerry R. Curry. Look at and see a true man of God, a proven leader, an African American retired US Army General, who is ready, willing and able to serve as President of the United States. This is the one we have all been waiting for. What will it take for the people to recognize who he is and for a movement to begin in support of General Jerry R. Curry?
    Please pray for him and his family and for God’s will to be done.

  48. A correction as to the date – it was in July 1998 and again in March 2002 that Kim Clement prophesied about a spirit-filled African American president (text provided by Carolyn Snow in her posting above):

    “Lift up your hands. I feel the liberty to prophesy this. Keep going, pray. For the Spirit of the Lord say’s,’ There shall be in the new millenium, an African- American president of the United States of America. God says, many will hate you,for even agreeing in saying this, but, I have chosen and designated it for the new millenium. God says, It will cause a massive stirring, a division that will cause me to come upon my church, and the kingdom shall arise,for the man that I put in the White House, says the Lord, shall be a spirit- filled man that knows the Lord, and knows of his greatness, and knows of his goodness, says the Lord.
    They will- – – – – – , but I will protect him says the Lord, for
    this man, have I raised up for righteousness sake, says the Lord, in the United States of America, for the world, says the Lord.”
    Kim Clement does not yet know it, but that man is spirit-filled, African American, retired General Jerry R. Curry. You can learn all about him at Please pray for God’s will to be done, as it is unknown how this all will come to pass.

  49. March 5, 2002 – TBN Broadcast

    The Spirit Of the Lord says, The very words of Dr. Martin Luther King before he died, knowing prophetically that he would not live, there is a dream that has not yet been fulfilled. It shall come to pass that I will take the African – American race, the people that have a strong leaning towards a spiritual life, and I will do something special for them, because I have told you, I will raise up an African-American president of the United States of America. I will put within him the wisdom of God and the power to be able to negotiate and take this nation into a higher level of authority and power.
    See ” The Vault ” at …

    The prophecy reposted above by Duncan was given in the month of “July,1998” through Prophet Kim Clement in Tampa, Florida.

  50. This may not be the time for an African-American president. Sanofi has directed us to a very informative website, Click on prophetic perspectives. It will take you to 2008 Prophetic Perspectives where you will see ” Prophetic words for the Year 2008 ” read more. Click and read….The election of 2008 is ….

    I hope I remembered that right.

  51. Sanofi has directed us to a very insightful website ; I should say, ” “

  52. C. Snow, then again this may be the time for an African-American president. Maybe some people are not ready for it.

  53. You know, maybe some of us Christians need to search our hearts to see if we have some hidden prejudice.

  54. I assumed that Kim Clement was talking about John Mccain when he was saying “a Democrat who is actually a Republican” and the next President will be a warrior. But I subscribed to the webcast of the Harrisburg, PA meeting from 3 -28-08 to 3-30-08 . I didn’t see his 3-28-08 webcast, but did catch the Fri/Sat webcast. Friday night he talked about Obama and Rev Wright. and the Pastor of that Church said Saturday before the service started “Did you know that Obama was in town today?” Several people smiled, that got me upset. I was afraid that meant Obama was going to be our next President. I don’t even like to watch him because of his liberal views and all the things we are finding out about him . I hope I am misreading what Kim Clement said. I don’t care what color or nationality our President is as long as he is conservative in his views and practices and has a strong faith in God. I know Obama says he is a Christian and not a liberal (his reputation says different), but he doesn’t practice what he is saying he is. How can you say you have strong faith in God but not only is for Abortion, but has said if his daughters make a mistake, he would not want them “punished with a baby”, meaning he would approve of them having an abortion. Great role model for a Christian father to be. I pray that Kim is not saying that Obama will be President in 2008.

  55. If you go to the Vault at you can see his most recent post from 03-29-08 where he says ” God said, I will sway it next week. Yes, I will, and because of Pennsylvania I will raise up the man I want, says the Lord, to rule and to reign and to declare victory in the Middle East. “. Then he goes onto talk about Obama also. Did anyoneelse see that? I hope I am interpreting it wrong…….because all that he has said about raising up a president does not fit Obama’s description.

    • You weren’t wrong in your intepretation about whom Kim was talking about really.America is in safe hands Ma’am.

  56. God uses the most unlikely people sometimes to get things accomplished for a particular purpose. Rember, HIS ways are not our ways. Remember we do not reason like God. Jesus being born in a manger is beyond my reasoning, . With my thinking I would think that maybe He should have been born in a palace. Such things as with God a thousand years is as one day and one day is as a thousand years. Gpd never does anything the way we think. He takes the foolish thing of this world to confound the wise.

  57. If God said He was going to sway it the week of Mar. 29 – Apr. 5, ( 40th anniversary of Dr. Martin Luther Kings death ) then that is what He has done whether we see it or not. God is invading the media as Kim has prophecied. Will God use Jeremiah Wright ‘s rantings to bring his man into the White House ? Kim did say, ” Enough of this discussion of Jeremiah Wright. This makes no difference. It is a spirit that has endeavored to rock and ” sway ” the people and to divide them. God said, ” I will sway it next week and because of Pennsylvania I will raise up the man that I want to rule and to reign and to declare victory in the Middle East. ” yet, Jeremiah Wright has come out speaking in the media over the weekend. God must have some plans of His own coming to pass behind the scenes.
    Because of our beliefs, we Christians vote Republican, so John McCain would be our choice for president. We must watch and pray from now till election day to be able to recognize the man of God’s choice for president. I do not know today who that man will be. It looks to me like John McCain won in Pennsylvania on April 22, but things are not always as they seem. I read a few days ago that Pennsylvania has not voted Republican in twenty years. Remember, whomever our next president will be, Kim has prophesied that God will baptize him with fire and the Holy Spirit…..pray, pray, pray.

  58. I do not plan to visit this website anymore ; therefore, I will not be making anymore comments after this one.

    ” T- w- t- t- a- h- t- t- , but I will protect him, says the Lord, for this man have I raised up for righteousness sake, says the Lord, in the United States of America — for the world, says the Lord. ”

    God bless America and our next president with righteousness, peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost. Thy kingdom come thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. . Amen

  59. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven.

  60. I enjoy reading Kim Clement prophecies. I believe that he is a true prophet.

  61. I could not help but think of the movie ” Evan Almighty ” when I read in a comment above that God was going to baptize our next president with the Holy Ghost and fire.
    Evan’s campaign slogan was ” change the world.” After being elected as congressman, Evan prayed before going to bed that night, asking God to help him change the world. He woke up the next morning to God answering his prayer…. to God’s will unfolding as Evan began to see, hear, and to obey the voice of God.
    I pray that it will be as Kim has prophesied with our newly elected president after he steps into the office of the presidency in 2009.


    Then click prophecies and then click usa.
    Read and check it out!

  63. Perry stone, VOE.ORG, has a couple things out about presidents. very intersting stuff!!

    just helping out

  64. Is Kim Clement’s prophecy true concerning Senator Barack Obama? He said that the Lord said he was preventing a Saul from entering the White House. A Democrate who is actually a Republican. I hear the sound of a child in the White House.

    All these words in times past from Kim Clement seem to be pointing to one person.

  65. I’m sorry. People get way to involved in prophecy. Yes it is real. Yes God moves through people. But the Bible tells us to judge prophecy with the word of God.
    Jesus Christ, does not want Barack Obama to be president. The man, himself, and his platform move against everything righteous in this country. From removing the ten commandments, removal of prayer from our schools, to attending a racsist church for 20 years.
    Jesus said you know those that love me by the fruit of their tree.
    Show me good fruit from the democrats? You can’t find any.
    I wont say who I am, but trust me. John McCain LOVES God, and is a righteous man.
    As Born again christians, I pray that whoever reads this will not vote for Barack Obama, not because of his skin, or where he was born from, or his experience (or lack of).
    Simply because of what he stands for.
    Can anyone here honestly imagine the apostle Paul supporting this candidate?

  66. To Joe

    No offense to you, but there is no way you can know the plan of God in this presidential election. You have no right to judge this man. Only God can do that. You cannot speak for every christian. Many Christians will vote for Barack Obama.

  67. I agree.

  68. From Nigeria, early this year I asked God during my prayer session who He has chosen as POTUS. He mentioned OBAMA; He confirmed Obama would have many obstacles but He God would see him through all of them. He asked me to WATCH and see how He would take Obama there. I received a knowing that God is now ready to fulfil MLK’s dream using Obama. He added that He would put Obama’s name even in the mouths of babes; CNN confirmed this in one of their special reports where toddlers were calling O-B-A-M-A effortlessly but unable to mention Clinton Hillary. I have since then pursued God’s rhema word concerning Obama and my faith is made stronger daily as the Holy Spirit keeps telling me to WATCH and see how God will berth His word. God has made His choice and no negative comments about Obama will change the plan and purpose of God, for He saw those negative sides b4 He chose him, even b4 Obama was born God knew him. Fear God. He chooses who to use; nobody can dictate to Him. His foolishness is better than the wisdom of men. It is wisdom to be on God’s side! Shalom

  69. Blessings without repentance? What kind of Bible do you read?

  70. Hank Kunneman prophecized that it wil be McCain to win.

  71. Sorry,

    Kim Clement gave a prophecy that Barack Obama would win and so did Stephen Odonga. Please research Hank Kunneman never gave a prophecy that McCain would win.

  72. Hank Kunneman only said that he felt that. But there was never a prophecy

  73. Hmm. Truth is, a lot of ‘prophecies’ are none other than people’s ‘i felts’. Odonga is a nobody. Clement and Kunneman are somebodies. Now, I’m not going to front, reading a lot of Kim’s prophecies…it sounds as if he could be trying to cover all his bases in order to make all the ‘vague’ prophecies seem to fit whoever it will be…

    but, to his credit he did state some clear pieces like, “Vice-President will be second to none…the gatekeeper that watched over New York will stand and watch over this nation…”

    but there are a couple contradictory ones like, “What’s this? An Independent that arises? A switch in power?….then, many Christians shall say, alas! a Democrat who is actually a Republican!”

    which one is it?

    then he says that “There will be a death…when death strikes there will be a change in power…”

    and then he does mention, “do not say that it can not be someone with ‘color’ in his skin!….can I not speak through a ‘donkey’…..”

    then that prophecy using Obama’s name. Hmm? Sounds like going back and forth.

    Finally, he is now saying, “when the new President takes office many will say, ‘what of the age? will there be death?…” That’s definitely McCain.

    so he is definitely sounding like he is covering all of his bases.

  74. also, now there is yet another apparent ‘prophet’ saying that God showed him that God’s chosen man was Huckabee. oh boy! there a word here a word, everrywhere a word, word.

    Lord please send us some true prophets like Paul, Isaiah, Samuel, and Elijah! Hopefully this TB Joshua guy is the real deal….

  75. I am so glad that God is in charge, because this would be very confusing to me if I had no one to put my trust in. My part in this election is to pray. Remember we fight not against flest and blood, but against principalities and powers. Prayer is what moves the heavens on our behalf. The second thing is to vote and to get everyone we know to vote for family values. Whoever will stand alongside of God’s word is who we want in the White House as well as the other offices that are open this election. Family values is what our country is built on. God established the family and that is what we need to keep in order. He also told us not to kill and what have done, but killed millions of innocent babies, God’s own creation, before they even had a chance to fulfill what God had planned for them. Also remember this is a very crucial election on the state level as well as in Washington D.C. Did you know that ALL 435 seats in the House of Representatives, 35 seats in the Senate, 70 state Supreme Court Justices and 35 Governors will be decided upon. The most sad thing about it all is that there are about 60 million evangelical christians in the country of which approximately only 15% of them vote and only about 24 of the 60 million are even registered. What are weconcerned about on our state level as well as the national level? Are we able to be in one of these positions? What is God wanting for each one of us to do? The best thing is to pray. Make sure everyone in your church is registered and for those who don’t want to go out an vote, get them to do a ballot by mail (absentee). Get a commitment from them. Find out who in your state level is a Bible believing, God fearing beliver and support them as well. Someone who will stand up for righteousness, the family with a husband and wife as the head of the household, stand against abortion. God will honor us if we do these things along with pray, pray, pray and then pray some more.

  76. I pray that it will not be McCain. God help us all.

  77. Edwin:

    How can you say Edwin that Odonga is a nobody? You can’t say that. God sometimes uses the nobodies. I would not call anyone a nobody,

  78. A prophecy given by Kim Clement on Feb. 16, 2008
    in Detroit Michigan. Paragraph 6 reads:

    Do not say we shall not have a man who is colored in his skin. He’s talking about Obama.

    Read it.

  79. First, to Nelie:

    by “nobody”, I mean he isn’t a reknown or respected prophet, such as Kim Clement and Hank Kunneman. So I mean he “has no track record” in other words.

    Secondly, to Derek:

    I already included that in my post, read it again. I showed that he has bounced back and forth “after” in 2007 clearly talking about Giulliani. To be fair, he hasn’t stated that by saying “do not say that it can’t be a man with color in his skin”…that it necessarily is him saying that it IS going to be a man with color in his skin…

    but my point is that Kim first mentioned that it will be “the gatekeeper that watched over New York when 911 happened that will watch over this nation” Tha’ts Mayor Giuliani.

    then he went to, “what is this? an Independent that arises? A switch in power?” This would cover Mayor Bloomberg or Senator Joe Liebermann.

    then he went to, “the Vice-President will be second to none and take over the land. A switch in power.” Could be any of the above so far…

    then he went to, the “don’t say it shall not be a man who is colored in his skin…..” also mentioned the God uniting African and White in his March prophecy.

    then he went to, “Christians will say ‘alas, a Democrat who is actually a Republican…” ???

    then he went to, “they will say he has hot blood.” Could be Giuliani, but not McCain or Obama.

    then he went to, “he will be ungodly before entering Whitehouse and ‘then’ God will fill him with the Spirit…” This can’t be Obama(who is already a Christian albeit an ungodly one. Same with McCain.

    finally he is now stating in the summer, “when the President changes guards, they will say, ‘what of the AGE? will he die in office?…” This is obviously McCain.

    Then hearing Hank Kunneman’s interview on DayStar, he mentioned that he and “another renown and respected prophet(implying Kim Clement) both gave the man that they believe to be the next president of the USA the prophecy that GOd told them that he was to be the next President.

    Kunneman hinted or implied that this man who received the prophecy ended up “withdrawing from the race” putting him in confusion to why did God name him the next President and he withdrew from the race?

    Kunneman also mentioned that the “wellknown prophet” also spoke with him about what happened and they both prayed over it and God showed them “both” that the next President will be INSTATED, not necessarily ELECTED.

    Kunneman made hint that the one that will be “elected” is the FORMER WAR HERO…that’s John McCain. But that this will lead to a Matthias type Acts chapter one voting in.

    So he continued with the man from NEW YORK that “WITHDREW FROM THE RACE”….that’s obviously coinciding with Kim CLement’s original “Gatekeeper that watched over New York during 911 will once again watch over this nation”….implying it indeed is Giulliani.

    So Kim mentioning that their will be a death and that the Vice-President will take over the land….are saying that McCain will be elected but will appoint Giulliani as his Vice-President. Then after a death according to Hank Kunneman, that their will be a similiar emergency vote to instate Giulliani as McCain’s replacement.

    The Obama thing is only being wondered about because of Kim Clement veering off in March with 2 prophecies about Obama and a man with color in his skin, though he didn’t say that they were the next President, but that the “christians” shouldn’t be “saying” this.

    On January 18th of 2008 was when Kim made the prophecy right before Super Tuesday about: “What is this Super Tuesday? I tell you a mystery: THe Vice-President will be second to none and will take over the land. THere will be a swift change in power.”

    Then, on the 30th, about 12 days later, Giuliani withdrew from Race.

    Again, definitely shows Kim bouncing back and forth covering all bases by going from Giuliani in 2007, then after Giuliani withdrew in January 30th of 2008, he made the 2 prophecies implying Obama as the guy.

    But then after speaking to Kunneman(according to Hank Kunneman’s interview on Daystar) Kim recollected his thoughts and went to prophecying that it is McCain that will be elected, with a switch in power following. Kunneman confirms the same prophecies.

    So you read it over. Read Kim Clement’s prophecies since 2005 about the next President until the modern prophecies of last week. Also, read Hank Kunneman’s prophecies regarding 2008 in his website

    Again, I am also refering to what Hank Kunneman stated on a recent interview on DayStar 2 weeks ago. Kunneman mentioned that the guy he and Kim prophecied to has “withdrawn from the race.” Giuliani.

    Obama hasn’t withdrawn from the race. Also Obama isn’t running for Vice-President(per Kim CLement’s prophecy).


  80. Edwin O.
    You sound confused! Kim Clement and Obama were in Chicago together.

  81. It is Obama.

  82. It is Obama, I know it is.

  83. Derek, why? Because you say so? Please. I kept it real and posted all that Kim has stated. He clearly started it all off with clearly prophecying that Giuliani is destined to be President of the US. Anything else he has stated on McCain, Obama, and now even stating an Independent will arise…is all after the fact.


    You make no sense. You state Obama, I know it is. How do you “know”?

  84. A reminder:

    Those of you who are stating that it is Obama, how does Obama fit any of the previous prophecies’ clues.

    Obama is not called hot-blooded.

    Obama is not and never was the gatekeeper that watched over New York when it fell apart during 911.

    Obama is not the ungodly man that has no inclination towards spiritual things that will then be changed after sitting in his office. (He has gone to a Christian church for 2 decades already).

    Obama has no problem with age and what if he dies in office.

    Obama is not a Vice-President.

    Obama is not an Independent.

    So there is no basis for this assumption.

    Assumptions are only based on “recent” prophecies that have just mentioned Obama’s name on one(not naming him the next President)…and a statement to the church to “not say it can’t be a man with color in his skin).

    Remember, you need to include “all” the prophecies regarding our next president, not just pick and choose some and leave out the rest.

  85. Edwin O.

    You will see.

  86. Nellie,

    it isn’t about “me seeing anything”, we aren’t talking about “me” nor are we talking about who “I” predict. we are talking about Kim Clement’s prophecies. did you lose track of the subject?

    we are talking about who “Kim Clement” prophecied would be the next president of the USA.

    he has clearly prophecied that Rudy Giuliani would “eventually” be instated into the Oval Office after being picked as VP of John McCain.

    now, the Obama prophecy that he made is something “after the fact” and it didn’t say that Obama was the next President, just that Obama was being unfairly spoken about by Jeremiah Wright.

    then the prophecy where Kim states “do not say that it can not be a man with color in his skin…” was a prophecy “exhorting the church” not to be racist for there eventually ‘will’ be a black President of the USA.

    again, in prophecies “after” both those prophecies, Kim made the statement that when the next President is elected many will say: “what of his age? will he die in office?”

    c’mon, Nellie, does anyone need to be a genius to figure out ‘who’ fits that description? who is the candidate that people worry about his ‘age’? McCain.

    again, very clearly Kim has stated that the “VP will be second to none and take over the land…”

    very clearly Kim has stated that the “gatefkeeper of New York that watched over New York when 911 took place will once again watch over this nation….”

    Very clearly, Kim has stated that the chosen one is Rudy Giuliani.

    also, let’s not forget that another well respected prophet, Hank Kunneman, has confirmed that he was told the ‘same thing’ by God: that, “MCCain will be elected President, but for a short season….and that New York was named as significant in the one that God instates to honor New York City…”

    also, again, Kunneman has gone on air stating that the one who will “eventually” be instated, not elected…was “one of the candidates who withdrew during the primaries….”

    those were his exact words. Obama has not withdrawn. Obama has no problem about his age and dying in office. Obama has no connection with New York City, neither did Obama watch over New York during 911. also, Obama isn’t vying for VP, he’s running ‘currently’ for President.

    so again, it isn’t who “I” think….but we’re talking about who “Kim Clement” prophecied would be the President of the USA for the next two terms.


  88. Edwin:


    (Stephen Odonga)

    Please read!

  89. Erwin:

    Please read the prophecy by Kim Clement that remains posted on his sight. March 29, 08

    Please read carefully

  90. Are you kidding me??? Wow! Did you even read my posts “at all”???? Wow!

  91. Nellie and Jeff,

    It’s like you just had everything just go by you and in one ear and out the next. It’s almost mind boggling. For the final time, “I”, that’s right, “I” am not the one making prophecies, Kim Clement is.

    Then, why do you continue to refer me to something I have already “refered”? I have already made mention of the Mar 29 prophecy. It doesn’t change his prior prophecies. That’s right, prophecie(s).

    Look all the way to the beginning of the thread. The one who started this thread clearly put down the initial prophecies that Kim made last year regarding our next President. He made clear assertions that it was Rudy Giuliani. Why haven’t any of you responded to that?

    I’m still waiting for your take on the April 4, 2007-Redding, CA prophecy clearly pointing to “the gatekeeper that watched over New York who will once again stand and watch over this Nation…”

    How is this Obama? Hello? Still waiting…

    Then, October 19, 2007-Fredrick, MD prophecy “for they will see what I will do in 2008, I’ll open the gate. I’ll send you the one that will watch over the nation just like he did when New York came apart…” How is this Obama? Hello? Still waiting…

  92. You are out of it. It’s Obama.
    No more comments will be posted by me.

  93. Wow, you clearly showed how irrational a poster I’m even speaking with. I thought I was on a mature thread. Guess not. How old are you? You must be younger than I thought.

    “You are out of it. It’s Obama. No more comments will be posted by me.” OMG, what a childish remark. Sigh.

  94. Anyways, this is to any other “less childish” posters.

    Anyone wonder what do you think Kim Clement is talking about by mentioning last year:

    “What is this? An Independent shall arise. A switch in power.”

    Also an the earlier ‘this’ year prophecy of:

    “Many Christians shall say, ‘Alas, a Democrat who is actually a Republican!”

    And of course, January of ‘this’ year:

    “I tell you a mystery: A Vice-President will be second to none and will take over the land. There will be a swift change in power.”

    Plus, Kim added:

    “This election will be an unusual one. There will be a death. I must watch what I say, for this is a spiritual matter. Many will be troubled. But this must take place.”

    Also, Kim added recently:

    “When the changing of the guards takes place. The new President takes over, many will say, ‘What of the age? Will he die in office?”

    Don’t these prophecies give a hint at someone like Joe Lieberman who is an Independent Democrat and is a rumored VP candidate for John McCain? Hmm?

    This is very confusing because there are two prophecies that Kim gave last year that went like this:

    “For God said, I will not forget 911. I will not forget what took place that day and I will not forget the gatekeeper that watched over New York who will once again stand and watch over this Nation, says the Spirit of God. It shall come to pass that the man that I place in the highest office shall go in whispering My name…” Who is he speaking of? Isn’t this Rudy Giuliani who was the gatekeeper of New York when 911 took place? Or could Kim be saying something else?


    ” they will see what I will do in 2008, I’ll open the gate. I’ll send you the one that will watch over the nation just like he did when New York came apart; I sent a man that would stand the ground. You’ll hear the sound of a child in the White House because I’ll open the door. I’ve opened a door that no man can shut. I will laugh at your enemies. As I raise your children up, they will come into the presence of the Lord. I will laugh at your enemies for in the White House I will place prayer will be his delight, America’s might. When prayer becomes your delight, that’s when America will no longer fight……..” Isn’t this repeating the same thing about Rudy Giuliani?

    I am well aware of two recent prophecies that could be a hint at Obama, so why these other prophecies?

    Let’s see, this Spring, Kim made a prophecy that stated:

    ” because of Pennsylvania I will raise up the man I want, says the Lord, to rule and to reign and to declare victory in the Middle East….” Hmm? ‘because’ of Pennsylvania? What does that mean?

    But he continues:

    “….For they have unfairly spoken against an African man and I’m not talking about Jeremiah Wright. I’m talking about Obama. For God said even though you may think this or that there is an element of righteousness inside of him to reach out for Jesus. Therefore I will sway it next week says the Spirit of God and I will cause My man, My power to exalt in the White House what is necessary to declare victory…. do not say is it this one or is it that one.” Here Kim sounds like he is endorsing Obama. Though Kim clearly puts at the top of the article(NOT AN OBAMA ENDORSEMENT, but a word concerning Obama). Huh?

    Kim says in another prophecy…:

    “Shall it be Democrat, shall it be Republican? God said this day I say to you it matters not, for where are the conservatives? I’m going to shock this nation. God are You saying that You can take a donkey and speak through him? Yes, indeed….Do not say we shall not have a man who is colored in his skin; we shall not have a man who thinks like us….I have prevented a Saul in the White House.” Huh? Sounds like an Obama endorsement now, doesn’t it?

    Anyone have any comments on “all” of the prophecies combined, not just the pick and choose the ones that support your favorite candidate?

    Sounds like Kim has “flip flopped” quite a number of times, doesn’t it?

  95. Edwin,

    Kim only speaks what he hears from God. I would not say that he has “flip flopped”. It is true that Kim has never prophesied that Obama would be our next president. I believe you are right on. You have taken the prophetic parts of this picture and made them quite clear.

  96. Hmm? Now that McCain has picked Sarah Palin as his VP, this may put a dent into Kunneman’s credibility as he has prophecied that a woman VP is not for “now”, but for a different season.

    Kim Clement has prophecied that Giuliani is supposed to become President via the VP route, though he has mentioned a “surprise” election will take place and that “an Independent shall arise”, who many will say, “Alas, a Democrat who is actually a Republican.”

    So could something take place from here to the elections and Lieberman and Giuliani join forces? Or Kennedy’s son who has a missing limb as VP?

    Don’t know, but Kim has stated that the one who is going to be elected, many will say, “what of his age? will he die in office?”

    So credibilities have been dented, but not altogether discredited until election day…so…sigh.

  97. Hi Edwin,

    I’ve been reading your comments and certainly appreciate your efforts to ‘put the pieces together.’ Much of this doesn’t make sense. I have been doing my own research on so-called modern day prophets (note, I am not against them), however I only find confusion when putting it all together. I think some folks are hearing from God and others are not. I’ve read prophecies by people who say Obama will be elected, then there are others who hedge the other way. At this point it is very difficult to predict. We all need to pray for God will be done.

    Regarding Kim Clement, he is really losing credibility in my eyes. ‘Hedging your bets’ prophecies are really generic and I question the value of them. The modern day prophetic stream has some contamination, so it seems (these are my own observations – no, I don’t know it all). Anyway, this is obviously a highly interesting topic. God bless. Tim in Seattle

  98. Hey Tim,

    Thanks man. Good to hear a rational voice. Yeah, I’m with you man, things looking kind of shady right now. I, also, realize to not know it all either.

    Now I am open minded to the fact that listening to Kim Clement’s services, that he does indeed have some pretty convincing prophecies whether over people or over events etc. that make him look somewhat legit. Not saying that I agree with all he teaches, but that he may be a real prophet.

    Now, yeah, he has been sounding a little flip flopping and confusing about this upcoming President, though I’m reserving my judgment for any other prophecies “prior” to the elections to where he may clarify himself.

    I guess, we can’t ignore the Katrina thing, the Bush election and re-election, and some other prophecies like 911 back in 96, and some other things about other countries….

    also, the fact that he is brave enough to come out and prophecy some things that you “have to be real” to dare say….but I am looking/listening with a cautious eye/ear. God bless you, man.

  99. SAD!

  100. I was watching a program from Perry Stone and he said that at election times there is a rise in confusion. I think we all need to get in our prayer closets and pray in the Spirit that God will lay in our hearts who we should vote for President. Enough of this bickering about which prophet said what. We all have direct access to God so let’s pray to Him!

  101. pitiful and sad all of this. I agree with Ann “Get into our prayer closets and stop all the hogwash. No one is correct and I believe Edwin is confused!

  102. Edwin. the pick of sarah palin as vp just confirms the kim Clement was talking about Barack winning the election this year. You are so bent on McCain winning that you are ignoring everything else that has been spoken of in the prophecies. I also checked the kunneman guys website and he wrote on there the next president will be a man of peace not of war.

  103. I sent a man that would stand the ground. You’ll hear the sound of a child in the White House because I’ll open the door.

    Obama has two little girls, so isn’t it possible that kim was talking about that? Hence the sound of a child in the white house? Also read the billion souls for christ prophecy, it confirms that Obama will be the next president.

  104. The sound of a child in the White House? Sarah Palin has 5 children. It might be that God has raised up a child to lead prayer in the White House under the next administration. Children praying in the White House.

  105. I guess we will have to wait and see then.:)

  106. ‘It’s neither white or black, Kim Clement says .Obama is neither white or black. This is something to think about.

  107. It is presumptive to assume that the statement ” gatekeeper that watched over New York who will once again stand and watch over this Nation” means President of the United Sates of America. Gatekeeper could also be a strong reference to “Secretary of Homeland Security” And that position could be offered to Guiliani from either McCain or Obama. Children could refer to Obama or Palin. “Hot Blood” seems to refer to McCain but who is to say that by the time this campaign season is over it won’t refer to Obama/Biden. Let’s simply pray that whoever these prophecies refer to that the next President will indeed be a person who prays for this nation the way these prophecies seems to indicate he will. God bless

  108. anything think that clement maybe wrong? personal story he had a word for me in 1996 and it was way off base…he is not perfect…worship God and not him and spend more time reading the bible and decerning that and not so much time picking over a sometimes wrong prophet

  109. Just maybe the next president will become “born again” after he takes office and become like a little child (spiritually) We do not get our identity from being either Rep. or Dem but from Jesus. I firmly believe that I will answer for the vote that I cast. God told Cain that the innocent blood of Abel cried out to Him from the ground. Do we actually believe that God is ignoring or agreeing with those who are contributing to the shedding of blood of millions and millions of innocent babies? How can anybody call themself a christian and vote for someone who puts “choice” on the throne and above the law of God? I would like to say to the christian who believes in abortion for ANY reason to remember that Jesus only gave 2 (TWO) commandments and that is “To love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength and to love others as yourself. If I kill my child or agree with someone who does OBVIOUSLEY I do not love God or others. WE all need to continually examine our hearts because we do not know when we will be in His wonderful presence and have to answer for the choices that we made here on Earth. We do not have to pray and seek God for whom we should vote for because it is clear from the Scriptures what we should do. We do need to pray that God’s will be done and rest in His peace.

  110. I am a Christian and I love Jesus. I also love OBAMA and will vote for him in November. Many Christians will.

  111. There is more to the picture beside abortion. There is the economy, healthcare, the war. jobs as well as abortion.

    Treva, please look at the whole picture and not just one issue.

  112. To Treva

    If you hate your brother you are a murderer. If you have an abortion you are a murderer. It is the same. Which one are you guilty of? Many so-called evangelicals do hate people of a different color and to me that is murder. How can you call yourself a Christian and tell someone how to vote?

    Get the facts straight according to the bible

  113. To Unknown:

    Murder is murder weather it is abortion or hating me because I’m black or white or hispanic, native american etc. I can’t hate you because of the color of your skin (that would be murder, SAME AS ABORTION in Jesus sight) and be right with the Lord Jesus Christ . Jesus said how can I love God whom I have not seen and hate those whom I have seen. Love is the key, and it COVERS A MULTITUDE OF SINS. Pray God’s will be done for the right candidate wether he is black or white etc. I’m also talking about myself and being real with myself when it comes to race. God help us all. This requires deep thought and prayers. When it comes to color we as most Americans cannot look past it. God Bless you precious folks, let’s be real.

    (Please make a righteous judgement) in LOVE
    because we are HIS disciples and not anything like the world

  114. Kim Clement has said that the next President will be one who many will say:

    “He has hot blood.”
    “What of the age? Will one die in office?”
    “He is ungodly.”

    Kim also said that the new President will be a knight who “fought for you in your nights.”


    Kim also said that many ‘Christians’ will say:

    “Alas! A ‘Democrat’ who is actually a ‘Republican’.”

    Then Kim also said:

    “What is this? An Independent that arises?”

    Sounds too close to McCain for anyone to even fathom that it would be Obama. Sorry.

  115. Also, I checked that Hank Kunneman “OVM.ORG” website and he was pretty clear who the next President of the USA was going to be as well:

    “….the nation will honor those who have shed their blood by the electing of a FORMER WAR HERO…”

    Sounds like McCain again, not Obama. Sorry.

  116. Anyone ever hear of Chuck Pierce and Dutch Sheets? They are well respected prophets known for making accurate prophecies. A prophecy was made by Chuck stating that America’s prophetic destiny will come from “Alaska”.

    Also, Dutch Sheets said that when he didn’t endorse Mike Huckabee(because the Lord told him that he was not the chosen one…many pastors emailed him with angry emails about it.

    Dutch Sheets then said that he and Chuck Pierce met McCain in Texas and gave McCain a prophetic word that said: “…you must keep your vow that you gave to Me when you were a POW…”

    Upon the lashing out at Sheets and Pierce for this seeming endorsement of McCain…Sheets responded with:

    “…you will not be electing the next President, but a Vice President…”

    Well, it just so matters that Kim Clement also has a prophecy that adds:

    “…a Vice President will be second to none and take over the land….”

    Chuck Pierce also was said to have prophecied to Sarah Palin that “….she will hold a ‘future’ Presidency of the USA…”

    Take that for what it’s worth. Sounds like Pierce and Sheets also are prophecying a McCain/Palin Presidency…

  117. on an aside: Sarah Palin is from the Alaska “Independent Party”….

  118. LOL..divine, can you give us the links of where sheets and pierce gave these prophecies? I know some of you automatically thing republicans = God’s choice and democrats= the devil’s choice but you are going to be in for a rude awakening this november.

    Btw, did you know that the alaska independent party is an extreme seccesionist group that wants to break away from America?

  119. where are you going to have your 666 placed?

  120. Divine, you are a Repub and would love to see McCain/Palin.

    Sorry,”It ain’t happening”

  121. Maybe future presidency. Lord I pray NOT NOW. She doesn’t know enough. I ‘m talking about Palin

  122. I would personally love to see Obama in office, but honestly I have to admit that aside from what I feel in my spirit, there are quite a few REPUTABLE prophetic voices that point towards McCain. At the end of the day, May God be glorified no matter who becomes President. And either way there will be a great need for healing after this election because this election will get much uglier and nastier before it’s over. No matter who wins the election, there will be a great need for the Church, the Body of Christ to be in great prayer and fasting for this nation.

  123. I feel in my spirit it’s Obama.

  124. J, you said that you feel in your spirit? Have you ever read the book of Proverbs? It says that the “heart/spirit” is very deceitful above all else. You’re not supposed to be going by what you ‘feel’ in your spirit, but by the Word of the Lord…

    A vegetarian ‘feels’ in his spirit that it is wrong to eat meat, doesen’t mean that it ‘is’ wrong to eat meat. The Apostle Paul said that there are those who ‘feel’ that it is wrong to eat meat, but that is just ‘their’ convictions, not the Lord’s word.

    The Apostle Paul mentions those who ‘feel’ that it is a sin to not get physically circumcised. That doesn’t make it a sin just because some ‘feels’ in their hearts that it is.

    This is what is very much an epidemic crisis in the Church today…people are led by what the ‘feel’ and think that that is the Lord.

    Jeremiah and Micah speak about those who dream ‘their’ own dreams, and those who prophesy out of the ‘own spirits’, but that it isn’t the Word of the Lord.

    Obama is a man who follows the anti-Christ spirit. He is anti-Life and pro-Abortion, he is anti-Family and pro-Gay lifestyle…his morals are not the Judeo-Christian/Biblical moral code….it is the Paganistic moral/immoral code.

    He needs salvation like us all….but this thread is speaking about who ‘Kim Clement’ prophecied was going to be our next President.

    He has mentioned clear prophecies about the next President pointing to McCain. Whether you still want to vote for Obama, that’s between you and God. But let’s not pretend or make stuff up to fit your viewpoint.

    Kim clearly stated that about our next President:

    “…they will say, ‘What of the AGE, will one die in office?”
    “…they will say, ‘He has HOT BLOOD…”
    “…he will be a knight who FOUGHT FOR YOU IN YOUR NIGHTS…”

    None of that applies to Obama. So keep it real and don’t fake your own self out now…

    Then, Chuck Pierce and Dutch Sheets’ websites are GLORYOF ZION.ORG and DUTCHSHEETS.ORG.

    On Youtube there is a video compilation of Kim Clements prophecies regarding the Next President. Some of that sheds a little more light as well.

    Also, OVM.ORG Hank Kunneman, who has been on Benny Hinn’s program has stated that the Lord has told him that an “ex WAR HERO” will be elected President. Obama doesn’t know anything about that, while McCain just happens to be an ‘ex war hero…”

    Let’s be clear now and stop faking the funk…

  125. Divine, what happens when Obama wins in november? That will mean kunneman and the other who said McCain was going to be president are false prophets? Check the polls right now, it doesn’t look good for Mccain.

  126. Read the article which just came out in the Rolling Stones Magazine about John McCain. Likewise last week’s in the NY. times article concerning gambling and Indian casinos. As a Christian who has recently split from my conservative prayer partners over this election I will not vote for McCcain/Palin. I stated that I was no longer a Republican or a conservative Christian who would vote on only one issue, abortion. There is too much at stake. As a mother of a special needs child I was initially suspicious of Palin because I do not believe she is the mother of Trig. And no way no how can you do both jobs, nor do I like the thought of someone lying about something so serious. I am also appauled by the fact that Cindy McCain is an heiress to a beer distribution company. Where I live, there are yearly deaths from kids drinking and driving. If McCain gets elected I will be totally blown away. I don’t trust the man one bit and his ties to lobbiest are appalling. I am also trying to figure out Kim’s propheies. A couple of years ago I read a prophesy about a “Prince out of Africa will become king”.
    Obama if he were not a man of color would be so far out in front the whole nation would vote for him. Presently, I am embarrassed to be a Christian. Even a pastor said in some paper somewhere that no Christian with any knowledge of the Bible could possibly vote for Obama. I am in the Word daily, has stopped writing” Words”from the Lord because they have gotten me in trouble. Some are right, some are still to be proved.

  127. Good post judy, the fact that some conservatives christans think McCain is a “better” christian than Obama even though he gambles, swears, has a hot temper, cheated on his wife, his wife makes her living off alchol etc. They give McCain a pass only because he is white and doesn’t have a muslim sound name.

  128. we must all agree that Jesus failed at being the savior and we need a new one…Obama is just the ticket to save us from ourselves…can’t wait to live in a country whose government provides houses, medical care and food…as he (Obama) says…the heavens will open and a light will shine down and we will have to go out and vote for him…and he will stop global warming and the seas from rising…point is our eternal security does not depend on this election…neither of these guys are perfect and neither deserve to lead this country but to be ashamed of being a Christian over this election is a scary thing…maybe some of us are taking God too lightly and this election too seriously…just ask yourself if marxism is godly….

  129. AEC. what does Jesus being the savior have to do with Obama. It is christians like you who belittle God to even dare compare Obama to Jesus. You so called christian neo cons are so scared of the fact that an intelligent black man is going to be the next president of the United States. The fearmongering of Obama is a terrorist, marxist, communist IS NOT going to work on the American electorate anymore. You never know the Great Plans God has for America through a president Obama.:)

  130. joe, barak thinks he is Jesus and kids march for him singing alpha and omega…if government is your god then you need to think about what it means to be a christian…don’t care if he’s black but am sure you won’t believe that…i vote on platform and the dnc platform mirrors the socialist party usa…it has for years…you are probably right marxism doesn’t scare any more because that’s what our educational system teaches and no one knows how to think for themselves any more…what is a neo con? i am more libertarian in my views… I am a Christian because I believe that Jesus is the only way to the Father…I also want limited government and lower taxes or no taxes…what could the church do to fix problems in the world if we had more of our own money to use…have you ever taken in homeless people yourself or fed the hungry yourself or do you look to the government to do it? I think that’s our responsibilty as individuals according to scripture…and yes i have…also took care of my elderly parents instead of sending them to nursing home…
    you totally missed the point…it’s barak and some of his followers are making the comparison…so obama’s belief that his god would not send people of another religion to hell does not make you cringe…some of you seem to be replacing God with government…God can work in spite of who’s in the whitehouse…

  131. AEC, barack doesn’t think he is Jesus is anyway! It is only the right wing loons who even make that comparison. I am not sure about your quote about Obama saying God would not send non believers to hell because i am pretty sure you have made up that quote or twisted it to fit your own Obama hating point of view. I don’t think you right wingers were complaining when your “idol” Bush said muslims and christians pray to the same “god”. You claim that God can work in spite of who’s in the whitehouse but your rantings clearly say otherwise. Have a good day and get used to praying for president Obama!!:)

  132. those are barack’s own words…bush is not my idol and i think he’s wrong in his belief that muslims and christians pray to the same god…the pope said so also…why don’t you read some of the early interviews with barack….i don’t have to make up anything or twist anything…everything is in the public domain for those who bother to look…my rantings prove God can’t work regardless of who’s in the whitehouse…of course i’d pray for president obama…your rantings prove that you too think barack is the new savior…

  133. God is looking for righteousness, not a president that “says” they are christian. Who cares about the political parties, skin color, or genders. The church has been wondering in the wilderness in America for almost 40 years. We let prayer in school slip from our fingers and we said nothing. We allowed an unending holocaust of the unborn begin and said nothing. Now we are seeing our country slowly (or not so slowly) legitimize through unchecked supreme courts the homosexual lifestyle. Guys, it’s time to get back to the Bible. Two of the three issues I just mentioned are the kind of sins that God actually calls abominations. They are the kind that will bring down an entire nation. Can God bring a lost person into the White House and then change him for His glory. Absolutely! Maybe that’s what He want’s to do this time. However, if I am going to err, I will err on the side of righteousness when I enter the voting booth. Look at both the candidates records on righteousness, pray, then obey.

  134. Exactly! Jacob, good sober post. Joe and Judy are extremely confused and/or decieved. Their posts show how misinformed and subjectively biased towards immorality and paganism.

    You are absolutely right, can God change a lost person once he is in the Whitehouse. That man would be John McCain according to many ‘known’ proven prophets like Kim Clement, Chuck Pierce, Dutch Sheets, Bob Jones, and Hank Kunneman.

    These leftist puppets are just seeing what they ‘want’ to see and being led by their own emotions. Like you said, God will judge each and every one of us for who we vote for this November 4th.

    God knows what is going to happen. And like you said, if one is going to err….err on the side of righteousness and voting your convictions based on righteousness. This God would bless whether every holy prophet of God was wrong or not.

    Finally, its pretty obvious that those prophecying that McCain/Palin is God’s chosen vessels for this nation are much more respected than Joe and Judy. Yes, pray, then obey.

  135. Divine, this is all fine and good. However, we must be ever watchful of the Jezebel spirit that so many times is intertwined with the political spirit. She seeks to take control of the Ahabs and kill the Elijahs(Prophets) in the land. We need true prophets who will begin to speak into the political system and not get cozy with it. Just look at the many men of God who of late fell into sexual immorality after being seduced into the political spotlight. Yes, even “prophets and apostles” seduced into a corrupt republican right! It is not just the leftists.

    We can no longer count on the left or the right for moral leadership. Jezebel has found too many inroads into the system. We need a generation of John the baptists to rise up. John the baptist coming in the spirit of Elijah was outside the system speaking into it. Too many prophets these days find themselves compromised, deluted and morally bankrupt when they discover the thrill of rubbing elbows with the big elephants. Then, we find out in the end, they’re all just a bunch of jackasses.

  136. Divine, i am not simply going to ignore the economic hardships facing america and vote for McCain in the hopes that McCain will somehow bring righteousness back to America. It is laughable to think that for the past 8 years that there was a “christian” president and a republican controlled congress, they couldn’t overturn roe v. wade, making gay marriage illegall or even put prayer in schools. Voting for McCain is NOT going to change anything morally or spiritually. Do you rightwingers think the apostles had the benefit of human laws during the book of acts? Bringing Morality and righteousness back has nothing to do with physical things or politics. Some of you urging people to vote for McCain would vote against Obama even if he was “pro life” and against gay marriage. Get ready for an Obama landslide this coming november.


  138. Joe, unfortunately it is true some may not vote for Obama for hateful reasons like race, or nationality. However, there are many “values voters” such as myself who are just waiting for the opportunity to see a strong values christian African American become president someday, someone like Rep. J.C. Watts from Oklahoma. Let’s take the issue of race for a moment in this election and how it relates to Martin Luther King’s dream, whom by the way I feel was a real prophet for his generation. I have heard many say that electing Obama will fullfill MLK’s dream. Is that true? What was his dream. Maybe we should go back and read his original speech about his dream. From what I remember of his dream is that we would, “Judge people on the content of their character and not the color of their skin.” This is what I will do in the voting booth. Is it not hypocritical for any of us to vote on the color of skin, whether for or against? This seems to be the opposite of MLK’s dream and a huge step backwards. Now we are left with a choice, to vote for McCain or Obama because of their skin, or to vote because of the content of their character.

    Character and spirituality aside there is one issue that this election is about. That is issue is SOCIALISM plain and simple. Honestly, both McCain and Obama are trying to take us their as fast as they can. After all the government bailouts and takeovers, we aren’t going to have much left that the government doesn’t run. Karl Marx would be proud, Thomas Jefferson would be weeping. Our materialistic greed has ran rampant from wall street to main street, from the white house to my house. We bought houses, cars and TV’s we couldn’t afford. Now that it’s all failing, we are screaming for the government to make it all go away. We think Obama or McCain’s got the goodies to get us out of the mess we made. We are ready and prime for socialism. When people are afraid they will do anything to stay afloat, even if it means giving up our freedoms.

    So here we are. I’m just waiting for Ryan Seacrest to come on stage so we can vote for the next American Idol. Maybe someday we’ll wise up and vote for a president.

    “my people are destroyed from lack of knowledge” – Hosea 4:6

  139. Thank you Jacob. This is very TRUE I couldn’t have said it better.

    To me this whole election is about race. Sad to say but many Christian people are racist but will not admit it. We can’t hide when it comes to Christ.

    What does Christian mean? Christ like
    Many people go to church, pray to God and thithe, but are STILL missing the boat, (so to speak)

  140. I have been following Kim’s prophecies concerning the 2008 election, as well as attempting to find others. Thanks for delineating the prophecies. I have some observations and concerns.

    1.” The next POTUS will be hot blooded.”
    2. A former War Hero.

    I certainly agree that these point to McCain and not Obama. Barrack Obama certainly does not have a temper or a reputation of having one. As for military service, this would definitely point to Sen. McCain.

    2. Gatekeeper of NY.

    I think someone correctly pointed out that Gatekeeper could be Secretary of Homeland Security or Attorney General. Rudi certainly fit this. One item that I’m surprised by is this. What of Hillary Clinton? Is she not the Senator of NEW YORK? Would she not be considered a gatekeeper? It is true that she isn’t a former gatekeeper.

    Here is a question. Could it be that Barrack Obama will become POTUS, but not in 2008? Is it not possible that Obama will be POTUS in 2012 or 2016?

    My “feeling” is that Obama has the potential to be a very good POTUS; however, I think his time is not yet.

    Spiritually, I have been feeling the need to pray for Obama, since February. These prayers had to do protection (physical and spiritual) and personal areas. I really didn’t feel a need to pray for McCain. Yet, I did feel a need to pray for Palin.

    Just a reminder. There are people who will seek to kill Obama; just because he is black. So, the prophecies concerning death can apply to Obama. It isn’t popular but racisim does exist in this country. Would it not make more sense to pray that God would use Obama to deal with this? I suspect that is what God is doing; as it relates to Obama.

    My personal plan is to vote McCain; unless God says otherwise. It may be that He’ll pull a Habakkah on me.

  141. First Joe, check out and educate yourself before commenting…because not doing this is making you look like a complete mule. Eehaw!

    Just for your information….the DEMOCRATS have been controlling both the HOUSE ‘and’ the SENATE for the past 2 years. So, no, the Republicans nor the Christians have not controlled the Congress for the past 8 years, no.

    If you actually study for yourself instead of just getting your misinformations from media pundits who slant and deceive in order for political brainwashing you would know this.

    Study first, then respond. Sigh. Blush.

  142. Then, Joe,

    bringing America ‘back’ to righteousness is what would bring back our prosperity. The backsliding of America is what has brought us this current recession. If we put away ‘greed’ and ‘immorality’ and the like…you’ll see what a turn around looks like….

  143. J, this election has absolutely NOTHING to do with race. Deceivers like yourself would mislead people into believing this as to confuse the people from the REAL issue….GODLINESS vs UNGODLINESS.

    Backsliding nation is why we are where we are today. If/’when we get our act together and vote VALUES then our nation’s economy and everything else will get back to normal…PROSPERITY.

  144. Kim Clement just prophecied in August that the next President, who will be called hot-blooded and an ex war hero…will said of many, “what of his age?”

    Well, recently in September Kim added that many will ‘mock’ and say it is the “WHITE”house. This is clearly saying that the liberals and those who would make this race about ‘race’…will be angry about not getting a black President yet and mock and call the whitehouse, the ‘WHITE’house.

    But also Kim has said that the next President will delight in prayer. McCain just appointed a prayer warrior in Sara Palin as his VP.

    But he just prophecied in September 20th that people will say “will a WOMAN bring prayer and righteousness to the white house from a political house?”

    Nuff said who Kim is talking about?

    Not to mention he prophecied in January about a Vice-President being second to none and taking over the land….and that many will be disheartened because he heard the Lord speak about ‘death’.

    McCain/Palin is who Kim heard God say, who Hank Kunneman heard God say, Chuck Pierce, Dutch Sheets, and now Bob Jones.

    There is even a female prophetess, who I forgot her name just prophecy that the next administration will have the mantel of Deborah in the Bible.

    Need we say anymore?

    Besides all the prophecies…it’s clear which administration and which candidates value God and His principles more.

  145. Divine,

    One of my primary goal is to better interpret prophetic words. I agree that it takes time to learn discernment.

    I haven’t read Kim’s prophetic word given on Sept. 20th –yet. I’ll head over and read it.

    One challenge is to learn when a prophetic word is meant to be fulfilled within this year or some time in the future. I did thought that some of the prophetic words about a black president had to do with Obama and the current election. I have no problem with being wrong; however, I want to learn so as to not make the same mistake again. 🙂

    Funny thing is, it has prompted me to pray for an end to the spirit of racism in this country and that the wicked would not take advantage. This whole thing has lead me to pray for Obama’s heart and that he’d be healed of the spiritual wounds. Am I being lead by God, in this?

    I said before that I plan to vote McCain/Palin. McCain is ready. I’m not going to judge his character. Did not Israel have a king who commited adultery and murder and a terrible father? Do we not like to put him on a pedestal? I’m referring to King David.

    I am so looking forward to seeing how God uses these three unique people: John McCain, Sarah Palin and Barrack Obama. 🙂

  146. “But he just prophecied in September 20th that people will say “will a WOMAN bring prayer and righteousness to the white house from a political house?” ”

    How do you know he wasn’t refering to Michelle Obama? Divine please provide links to all the prophecies you are talking about. It is hard to take you seriously when you refuse to give links to back up what you are saying. From what i have seen about Sarah Palin right now, she is vindictive, mean spirited and coniving. Hardly the traits of a prayer warrior IMO.

    Here is what Chuck pierce and other prophets had to say about the next president
    The Apostolic Council of Prophetic Elders
    C. Peter Wagner, Cindy Jacobs, Chuck Pierce and others,,


    United States
    The United States has been saved from those who would remove God from its borders, but now the nation must be established. There is a four-year window for the intercessors to war for the establishment of morality and righteousness. God is going to raise up a president in 2008 who will reconcile the nations to the United States. Bush has been called to be a man of war, like David, but God is bringing a Solomon to the office in ’08 who will make peace with the nations.


    So now they said God is bringing a solomon and a man of peace into Office. We all know that McCain IS NOT a man of peace but a Man of War. Check out billionsoulsforchrist about the prophecy about Barack being president also.

  147. I just read Kim’s Sept. 20th prophecy off of his website. Here it is.

  148. Sorry, thought I could code a link in the text. Here it is again.

  149. Joe and Divine,
    Here is the quote that Kim uses refering to an African American president.

    “For it is a stench unto Me, says the Lord, to hear men speak about the possibilities of an African American president with disdain. I’ve already told you that there shall be an African American president that shall come to rule but it shall come in My time. It shall come in a time of maturity, it shall come at a time that is perfect for this nation.”

    Notice he is not saying that now is the time that we will see an African American president. Kim is simply saying God is tired of the disdain. Furthermore, Kim says an African American will become president in God’s time and “in a time of maturity.” That does not necessarily mean THIS time. Also, in this prophecy, Kim never says that Obama with be the one to fullfill this prophecy. Honestly, I’m a little partial to a J.C Watts, but hey, I’m not God. Thoughts on the prophecy?

  150. Jacob, how do we know this is not the time for Obama to be president? The prophecy didn’t necessarily say that it won’t be this year. Remember a day is like a thousand days to the lord and a thousand days is like a day to the Lord.

  151. Joe, my point exactly. We don’t know either way. Kim did not specify when this will happen, only that it will happen “in a time of maturity.” I think we’re agreeing on the same thing, though I think it is interesting that Kim mentions that “a time of maturity” must first take place. Has that maturation come? Maybe so, I don’t know.

    A side note on prophecy. I tend to test modern day prophecy against a few criteria’s. Here they are:

    1. Does the message and theology line up with scripture or at least the heart of God found in scripture.

    2. We are told in scripture that “in the mouths of two or three witnesses every word is confirmed. (2 Corinth. 13:1) Therefore I look for confirming signs that back up that word. For instance, other prophets, people or situations that are totally detached from the situation that point to the same word. Definately more than just someone already prevee to the word If there are no confirming words then I put the word on the back burner and just pray about it.

    3. Are there any alterior motives coming from the messenger that are noticeable? For instance, letting political leanings get in the way of actually hearing God’s voice. However, issues such as homosexuality and abortion that are plainly spelled out in scripture can sometimes be used as political levers to gain votes. Even though politicians do this, it should not cause us to throw away these core values because it has turned political. Alterior motives outside of scripture can pollute the stream of the prophetic word and eventually shut down a person’s ability to hear God all together. There is nothing wrong with personal opinions, but when God speaks we all should be quiet and listen.

    4. Does the prophet’s character match his or her gifting? Too many times, especially in the charismatic church we follow someones gifting over their character. Hello Todd Bentley, hello Paul Cain, hello Ted Haggard, hello Bob Jones, hello to way too many to name.

    5. Lastly, we must pray.

  152. Jacob,

    Hmm, it may be that we’re going through that maturation process.

    I read your list and would like to add one more.

    6. Take care not to read your own agenda into what the prophet has said. It is real easy to do.

  153. Jacob

    Barack is not African American. He is 1/2 black and 1/2 white. Read the prophecy carefully, it’s talking about African American. Barack is NOT African American.

    Barack will win

  154. Jacob,

    Please understand this, Barack is NOT African American. People are missing this in the prophecy. He only calls himself African American

  155. J,

    On the contrary Obama is more “African American” than most black people in America are. His dad is from Kenya (African) and his mom is from Kansas (American).

  156. j,

    I know, it’s not exactly what you meant, I was kind using a play on words, but in all honesty he has much closer “African” roots than most black people in America because of his Kenyan dad. You are confusing color with nationality.

  157. Even though he is from Kenya (African) he is still 1/2 black and 1/2 white. Not truly African American.

    His nationality is not African American

  158. J,

    Let’s see. You’re saying, “To be African American, both parents must be black?”

    Eh, my dad is Italian and my mother is a mix of Italian & German. What am I? I look at myself as an Italian American. I see no difference between Barrack and Barry. 🙂

  159. you can’t be that stupid

  160. Barry,

    I wouldn’t even respond to J. When people start to name call you know it’s something other than the Holy Spirit that’s driving them. Going any further will just make you look foolish. This blog is about looking at the upcoming election from a kingdom perspective, not a right or left wing perspective and definitely not in a degrading spirit like calling someone stupid.

  161. Jacob,

    I saw the reply and had no intention of responding. I’d already prayed that God would deal with his heart.

    As for me, I have an interest in seeing how the various prophecies line up and am seeking what God is purposing to do in this country.

    Of late, I’d like to get a sense of what God is doing long ter with the US economy. He is definitely shaking out the corruption in Wall Street and driving out the speculators.

    From some of Kim’s prophetic words and Bob Jones, I know this shaking is for a short time. I am watching with interest. I will say this, “Praise God!”

  162. Barry,

    “At that time his voice shook the earth, but now he has promised, “Once more I will shake not only the earth but also the heavens. “The words “once more” indicate the removing of what can be shaken—that is, created things—so that what cannot be shaken may remain. Therefore, since we are receiving a kingdom that cannot be shaken, let us be thankful, and so worship God acceptably with reverence and awe, 29for our “God is a consuming fire.” (Hebrews 12:26-29)

    God is obviously shaking this nation. The good new is, there’s a kingdom to receive in the midst of all this. Also, I’ve got to be honest in saying that God has been shaking the church too as of late. I’ve been in the prophetic/ apostolic/charismatic movement for many years now and I must say I’ve been very concerned about the lack of emphasis on purity and holiness in this part of the body of Christ. It’s “the little foxes that spoil the vineyard” (Song of Solomon 2:15) and we must deal with these little areas of compromise in our life. Because the spirit of the prophet is subject to the prophet we must allow God to purify that prophetic stream that is flowing through us.

    All in all, if we look at all this shaking through a kingdom perspective, it’s very encouraging because what will remain is a greater manifestation of the kingdom and the King.

  163. Get ready for a Nobama landslide!

  164. I have a much better idea.

    Why not pray for God to touch both men; regardless of personal political ideology.

    When I look at Obama, I perceive a man who has been spiritually wounded in different ways. I’d been praying that God would help him to forgive those who’ve hurt him, change his heart on issues like abortion and socialism. Finally, God would draw him into a real relationship with His Son.

  165. Barry,

    I definitely see some serious hurts in both candidates, with McCain’s short temper and all. If John McCain truly is the “hot blooded” man that KIm Clement is talking about, then supposedly God is going to apprehend him AFTER he arrives into office. After careful reading of Kim’s words it seems to me that it is McCain he’s talking about.

    Consider a few of those words.

    1. Hot Blooded – This describes no one better than McCain and boy is it a temper. Obama is known for his cool, calm, and collective demeanor.
    2. Democrat that’s actually a Republican – McCain has been the most unpopular Republican among his party. He’s always been know as a R.I.N.O. (Republican In Name Only) and is barely put up with by true conservatives. His name was even thrown around as John Kerry’s VP in 2004.
    3. They will say he is ungodly – When McCain first became the Republican nominee, most evangelical leaders rejected him. Exampe: Lou Engle, James Dobson, ect… It wasn’t until Sarah Palin came on the scene that many evangelica’ls changed their tune. I know for me, if Palin wasn’t on the ticket I would probably not even consider McCain. His temper and horrible language bares mentioning again too.
    4. What of his age? – Need Kim say more? From the news to David Letterman, John McCain’s age is the butt of many a joke.
    5. A vice president that is second to none – From an evangelical christians point of view who feels pro-life and family value issues are important, this would definitely be true for Sarah Palin. Once again, Sarah is the main reason that any strong evangelical would be voting for McCain right now.

    I guess we’ll just wait and see.

  166. Small correction for number 4. Kim’s exact words were actually, “What of THE age? Will one die in office?”

    We’ve definitely heard this many times about McCain.

  167. Thanks Jacob. For doing your homework. Also to just add on, Kim Clement just held a live online stream press conference, if u will, this past Saturday and he made very clear by answering some emails that he was definitely talking about John McCain.

    He answers an email that stated that he has gone back and forth by endorsing both candidates. Kim answered by stating that he never endorsed Obama. He said that the prophecy about Obama was just God clearing his name on some issues that were being spoken about him unfairly and that God loves Obama “also”.

    He said that he has been very clear who God has told him will be our next President, John McCain and that Sarah Palin is carrying on her an Esther anointing for such a time as this.

    So, this should end all debates. If anyone still wants to endorse or vote for Obama, let them do this at there own personal life’s risk between them and God. Amen.

  168. Divine,

    What about the following prophecy Kim gave on March 14th 2008.

    Do not say, ‘We shall not have a man who is colored in his skin; we shall not have a man who thinks like us.’ I put Saul in command and look what he did. He was right, he looked good, he was head and shoulders above everyone else, and yet look what he did to My priests.” God says, “Do not always say we need a Christian in power.” The Spirit of God says, “This may be a dangerous thing, for there is a Saul that I’ve prevented from coming into the White House.” Listen to what the Spirit is saying, “I have prevented a Saul in the White House–you think and work it out as you want.”

    Who is the “Saul” that God is preventing to enter the White House? In context, this seems to to speak to our mislead desire in always needing “a Christian in power” according to Kim. Am I misreading this?

  169. OBAMA

  170. Hi everyone, I like to throw in something I read a few days ago. It’s a prophetic word by Cindy deVille. You can visit the link below for the entire message, I am only excerpting the critical portion of it here:

    I keep hearing God say – regarding the elections
    “I will move them in the right way when it comes election day.”

    The polls and the trends may look one way,
    But when it comes to election day,
    I’ll move them the right way.
    I’ll move them the right way.

    For I will have My way in this nation
    For I hear the cries of My people, My creation, My people, I hear their cries
    Those who are truly mine.
    Yes this is a critical time, this is a crucial time
    but I will move things My way, I will have My say
    Continue to pray, continue to pray

    For I am bringing all things into line, into line for the end of time.

  171. txsunshine,

    “but I will move things My way, I will have My say
    Continue to pray, continue to pray”

    Are your sure that’s not Dr. Suess? Just kidding. That is a pretty encouraging word. No matter what happens, God’s kingdom is not going to stop growing no matter what the “rulers” of these earthly kingdoms do or say.

    “There will be no end to the increase of His government…” (Isaiah 9:7)

  172. For those who seem to insist on Obama, I have this suggestion. Pray for Barrack Obama. Pray that God would touch his heart and draw him into a deeper and real relationship with his Heavenly Father. A Father who did not abandon him, as Barrack’s earthly father did. Pray that God would deal with any issues of unforgiveness that may be in Barrack’s heart. Whatever demonic stronghold that may be in his life, pray that these be overthrown and Barrack’s heart is washed clean by the precious blood of Christ Jesus. Don’t just do it until Election Day.

    The same should be applied to John McCain.

  173. One might want to read a the portion of AUDACITY OF HOPE by Barack Obama which speaks about his faith and walk. before speaking that he is not a Christian. Then go to the parts where he stood on the street corners with the local preachers to meet people in the south side of Chicago.
    He makes it very clear as to what he believes and judging from the prayer put in the temple wall in Jerusalem, I am convinced. But it has already been determined by self righteous Christians that I know and those who represent the extreme right that he could not possibly be saved. My thoughts how amazingly arrogant. I have left the Republican party for this man, I have learned just how stupid I was to fall for the last two elections and vote without using my head instead of just my heart. Google, the Mathew 25 group or Christians for Obama. How amazingly refreshing and active for good. I found I was not alone in this bazarre time. Then if you are really brave and want to learn look to the articles I referenced earlier in the month.

  174. Judy,

    Let’s first lay this one foundation. The term “christian” means a follower of Christ and according to Jesus, fruit must show that we are.

    After observing McCain for some years now and how he has voted, I must be honest in saying I have not seen much “fruit” in McCain’s “christian” faith. The choosing of Sarah Palin on the ticket is all that many of us evangelical Christian’s have to go on.

    As far as Obama, he may be a christian, who can know his heart but God. What we can do is look at his fruit as Jesus told us to do. Let’s review a few key positions that Obama is taking and look at that fruit.

    1. Abortion: I know, it’s the broken record of christians for years but lets review anyway.
    – He’s for Late Term Partial Birth Abortion where the doctor gets to crush the child’s skull and suck his brains out with a hose. Hmmm. Now let’s use the ol’ WWJD test. Yeah, I don’t think Jesus would be real pleased with that one, but it’s like you said. I guess I need to start using my head more right Judy?
    – He’s for allowing infanticide. That’s where the abortion is botched and the child lives after he’s born. Instead of giving the baby a chance to live or give him what’s called “comfort care”, they just throw the baby in a trash can while he’s still squirming. Feelin’ the Spirit yet Judy? Yeah, I know, Obama didn’t sign the bill to protect from this happening because it may have been an “evil” republican attempt to eventually outlaw all abortions. What a shame that would be right?
    – He has said he doesn’t want to “punish” his kid’s with a baby. Wow! Babies are a punishment? Now that’s a real sermon in the making from Mr. AUDACITY OF HOPE. I’m glad God thinks differently about us. “I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; that I know very well”(Psalm 139:14)

    2. Pro-Gay rights – I know I should be voting with my head and not just my heart Judy but the pieces just don’t fit together either way. Pun intented. For scripture on what God’s thinks of the homosexual lifestyle, here ya go. (1 Corinth. 6:9-11, Romans 1:18-32, Gen. 19:1-11) Yeah, it’s only the sin that actually brought down two entire cities in the Bible called Sodom and Gomorah. No problem, let’s see how far we can get by in America. God will just keep turning a blind eye right Judy?

    3. He has actually publicly mocked the Bible and has taken it out of context. Here’s a link to the actual video.

    4. He has attended a church for over 20 that spews racial hate, strongly supporting what’s called “Black Liberation Theology”. Here’s there core values.

    “We are a congregation which is Unashamedly Black and Unapologetically Christian… Our roots in the Black religious experience and tradition are deep, lasting and permanent. We are an African people, and remain “true to our native land,” the mother continent, the cradle of civilization. God has superintended our pilgrimage through the days of slavery, the days of segregation, and the long night of racism. It is God who gives us the strength and courage to continuously address injustice as a people, and as a congregation. We constantly affirm our trust in God through cultural expression of a Black worship service and ministries which address the Black Community.”

    Wow, I’m sure glad it’s all about Jesus and nothing else! If Sarah Palin went to a church for over twenty years that said, “We are a congregation which is Unashamedly White and Unapologetically Christian” she’d be toast right now. Or how about my favorate, “We are an African people, and remain true to our native land.” Yeah, all that stuff about ” There is neither Jew nor Greek…in Christ Jesus” (Gal. 3:28), that’s all crap. A far cry from a candidate who says they want to bring us all together to set all our differences aside. “Pride goes before a fall.” (Proverbs 16:18) And that means white pride and black pride!

    It’s all sounding pretty christian to me so far Judy but who am I to say. I’m just a part of the “extreme right”. Remember, there are still some things in this world that are “extreme wrong”. Look Judy, wake up! With McCain AND Obama, it’s all a show. I’m sure finding Obama’s prayer at the waling wall was just an “accident”. We at least know where Palin stands. She doesn’t back down from what she believes and yeah, she’s paying for it with the endless mockery from the media and Hollywood.

  175. I did a study on Sodom & Gomorrah. According to Ezekiel, there were multiple sins that brought down the destruction on these two cities. This isn’t to diminish the sin of homosexuality; however you do need to see what else was happening. It was not just a “gay thing.”

    I read the reports about Obama’s support for abortion. It is for this reason that I believe it to be demonically driven. It just make no sense, otherwise.

    Yes, I am using my mind. I am not just reacting. For me, I really don’t care about conservatism or liberalism, Democrat or Republican. If God is not in the midst then they are worthless. If it is being pursued in our own strength then it is useless.

    Please bear in mind that the Spirit will not go against what is clearly in the Scripture. Why should He? He wrote it. It is up to us to take the time to read Scripture and learn.

  176. Divine, how come you NEVER provide links to back up what you say?

  177. I checked out Cindy Devilles prophecy, we will just have to wait and see. If Barack Obama wins, her credibility will be severly hit.

  178. Btw, is it soo hard for some of you to believe the Lord can use Barack or a democrat to do his will? Every single election that takes place, you see some of these prophets always saying nice prophetic words about republicans. I bet if you searched through the 1992 and 1996 prophetic words, you will find prophecies predicting a republican win.

  179. Joe,

    God absolutely can use a democrat, or a republican for that matter. I would not be surprised if God wanted to use a democrat to bring about righteousness in our government just to show us He’s God and we are not. On the same token, when we vote, we vote by reviewing past voting records and unfortunately democrats have not been very “Jesus friendly” if you will for about the past 40 years. Actually, those of us who are these christian “value’s voters” are actually caught in a dilemma with the following.

    1. In recent years, many in the republican party have lost there own core values and have compromised their personal and political lives. Though they have been known as the pro-life, pro-family, and pro-God party, we know these issues are just tools for many of them to use us for political gain. However, now the political “tent” has been widening in the republican party with more and more “non-values” republicans taking major places of prominence in leadership. This has left many of us in the evangelical community feeling lost with less leaders to represent us.

    2. As far as the democrats go, in the last 40 years “most” have done all they could to strip away our judeo-christian foundation that was laid by the founding fathers of this nation.

    Let’s look at they’re 40 year progress. Prayer in school? Gone. Removing references to God, the Bible, and the ten commandments in our government? Almost gone, but they’re working on it. Allowing the holocaust of the unborn? Done. Removing the Biblical meaning of marriage between a man and a woman? A couple of states down, only 48 to go. However, one good thing that has come from the democrats is the civil rights movement. Unfortunately, just like the “values voters” and republicans, the civil rights issue has now devolved into a tool of manipulation to keep democrats forever voting for democrats.

    In many ways, both party’s have lost there soul. We’ve wondered in the wilderness for 40 years? Revival is the only answer for our nation. Not McCain and not Obama.

  180. Jacob,

    The King Saul/Christian in office God was speaking about was apparently Mike Huckabee. During the March 14th prophecy the majority of the Christian world was on the Mike Huckabee bandwagon during the primaries. Kim Clement and Chuck Pierce both refused to endorse Huckabee leading to a backlash from Dobson and many other Christian leaders.

    Also, Kim Clement clarified that question on Saturday’s live webcast by saying that he was NOT endorsing Obama but giving a rebuke from God about Christians that were saying that they did not want a black President. He went on to say that there will eventually be an African American ‘righteous’ President but not now.

    He has very clearly stated that John McCain was the man God chose. Same with Chuck Pierce. In fact, Pierce and Sheets both received backlash from Dobson and others for endorsing John McCain instead of Huckabee.

    So to answer your question, McCain/Palin are the ones that Kim, Pierce, Sheets, and Kunneman have all prophecied are going to win the elections and be God’s anointed in banning abortion in America.

  181. Joe,

    Common sense and truth back up what I say. Then what link is there to provide? They have already been provided by the previous posters of the thread. click on prophecy and go one by one and read each of his prophecies that date from present date to 1996. is the Hank Kunneman website click on prophetic perspective.

  182. divine, Kim clements’s prophechies are inconclusive!!! How about the other prophecies posted on here that indicate an Obama win? We will just have to wait till election night. I am sure some of these prophets will have egg on their face.

  183. God says a President that I will bring into the White House they will say he is ungodly, he does not know God. Even as Jesus disguised himself for the great feasts, so I’ve disguised this man’s heart. When he comes to the White House not only shall he be Mine but he shall pray as a man that has never prayed in the White House. That same man shall put his feet onto this platform. They will say how did this take place? Laws shall change. Young men and young women will have access into the kingdom and with authority into politics and with authority into the industries that now have been controlled by darkness because of this man that shall rule for two terms. Do not fear there will be no unnecessary stuff. There will be things that men shall question. Fear not for he shall sit in that seat and suddenly My Spirit shall come upon him and baptize him with a fire and with anointing says the Spirit of the Lord. No more war. The time for war has gone. The time for Peace has come. The House that you call White shall receive a man, a knight, who fought for you in your nights…..

    2 terms? Didn’t Kim prophecy a death in th first term? Don’t you guys think Obama is ungodly? Why the riddle about THE HOUSE YOU CALL WHITE SHALL RECEIVE A MAN? Is he indicating the man being received won’t be white? This prophecy is clearly talking about Obama. Note the talk about young people gaining higher access in gov’t. Btw, divine the knight who fought for you in the night isn’i McCain.

  184. Btw, i read Kunnemans prophecy in january about the economy turning around swiftly etc, but that seems not to be the case now is it?

  185. Again, for those who continue to veer away from the clear word from God and into the hype and misinformation of politics…

    Kim Clement is respected for the simple fact that he is a real prophet of God. He has said too many times prophecies that have come to pass. Thus why the respect world wide to what he prophecies.

    Kim Clement prophecied back in February of 2007 in Phoenix, AZ…(a whole year before the primaries nor had anyone declared who had decided to run for President at that time)…and anyone can go to his website and click on prophecy, log in, and scroll through each and every one of his prophecies from the present day back to 1996…concerning the next President of the USA:

    Kim prophecied: “… “They will say that he has HOT BLOOD…yes he may have HOT BLOOD, but he will bring security to this nation…”

    Kim prophecied this over and over for a few months and then in June of 2007 added: “…this next President of the USA, they will say he is UNGODLY, but I will fill him with My Spirit upon entering the WhiteHouse…he will be a knight who fought for you in your nights….and many will say, ‘How did this take place???…laws will change in favor of the Most High God…'”

    Kim added in October of 2007: “…you will hear the sound of a child in the Whitehouse….”

    Then in November of 2007: “…many Christians will say, ‘Oh no! A Democrat who is actually a Republican! But God says, Fear not for a while and I will fill him with My Spirit…”

    Enter election season and the primaries started. Kim had already stated on many of his meetings that he not only knew who the next President of the USA is but that he has met and spoken with him about what God has spoken to him about the elections.

    In January of 2008 during the primaries Kim prophecied: “What is this Super Tuesday? It matters not. There will be a Vice President who will be second to none and will take over the land.”

    Then in February of 2008 Kim prophecied: “Do not be disheartened at the elections, for you shall be, many of you. To the term starting, God spoke about death….but when death strikes, resurrection comes after….when death hits many will say, ‘What do we do now?’ there has been a death!…God says I will prove Myself in this administration…for there will be a change in the next four years even though elections took place…when this takes place people will get fearful and My Prophets will be needed and invade every department of government…”

    Then in August of 2008 Kim prophecied: “when the new President comes in, they will say, “What of the AGE? Will one die in office?”

    Then in September of 2008 Kim prophecied: “they will say, will a WOMAN bring the Spirit of God to the WhiteHouse from a political house?…many will mock and say, ‘It is the WHITEhouse’….’they are quakers and pray like nuts in the Whitehouse’….

    Now in October in Kim’s live webcast he clearly answered an email about didn’t he endorse Obama earlier this year? Kim said, “NO”, that Kim’s prophecy about Obama was just a scolding to many Christians about that God loves Obama “also” and that we should pray for him.

    Kim said that if what he has prophecied doesn’t come to pass, then he will not continue being a prophet. Kim said that he knew what God told him will take place.

    Kim reiterated that people confused some of what he said regarding that God showed him that eventually in the future there will be an African American President that is “righteous”, but that now is not the time and that it will come in “God’s” timing when America is mature.

    Right now, McCain/Palin will enter the WhiteHouse for the purpose to change the laws of American and undo many sins and change laws in favor of the Most High God. Kim also said that Roe v Wade will be overturned by this administration coming up.

  186. Joe, There is no prophecy indicating an Obama win. None. So I don’t know what you are talking about on that one.

  187. Joe,

    It’s good that you are doing your own digging into this. If God want’s use Obama to accomplish His perfect will, that’s awesome! However, it seems you are ignoring the other many prophecies that Kim has spoken and some points in the prophecy you just quoted from Kim.

    John McCain was a Knight (American Soldier) who fought in our “nights” during the Vietnam War. I am all open to any suggestions you may have that Obama could even possibly fit this description.

    Also, John McCain has definitely been deemed as “ungodly” and rejected by the most prominent christian leaders such as James Dobson. Only Sarah Palin has changed there minds. Let there be no mistake, MOST EVANGELICALS ARE VOTING FOR PALIN, NOT MCCAIN!

  188. ACtually, it does seem to be the case. Kim said that by Thanksgiving we will be very thankful about our economy….that this is for a short time.

    Joe, you must understand what is “REALLY” going on.

    This economy stuff is is merely “political sabotage”. Just open your eyes and take a look with an unbiased eye.

    GW Bush had 6 years with a Republican Congress and the economy was at a better state than Bill Clinton’s years. And all this during a war, which gives an even greater testament at the heroic effort that our President has given.

    Coincidently, once the Democrats took over Congress in 2006, the economy began to go the opposite direction. This July, the offshore drilling issue was being procrastinated by the Democrats in Congress for a single purpose…

    Nancy Pelosi and those selfish leftists refused to allow for offshore drilling because of the simple fact that the elections were coming up in November.

    They simply wanted to sabotage the economy in order to wrinkle our President’s legacy and cause the public to shift towards the Democrats in the election. It’s as clear as day.

    When August came around, if you recall, the Republicans held a protest where the Democrats turned off the mics and lights on Capitol Hill because the Republicans wanted a vote “for” offshore drilling that would give the economy a temporary/short term help to bring down gas prices.

    Nancy Pelosi refused it and stated that they will consider this ‘after’ the month long vacation that they were approaching. The Republicans made news about what the Democrats were doing.

    They were basically procrastinating in order to get closer to the elections so that when they approved offshore drilling, it would be by the time the economy got so bad and made the President look bad, this would cause the public to have a low opinion of the economy and hopefully sway this for a Democrat win in November.

    It’s pure political sabotage and pure disregard for the welfare of the nation and the economy of the people.

    The plan was to postpone the vote for late September. By then, both Party Conventions would have taken place and much of the damage would have been done agains the President.

    Now, the economy is in the state that the Democrats sabotaged it to be in in order to make their chances at the WhiteHouse more advantageous for them.

    Once they pass the offshore drilling, they hope to have a Democrat in the WhiteHouse and when the economy begins to swing for the better because of a simple move they could have passed before the summer it would serve for a political purpose for their Party. You see?

    This is pure politics at its worst and you my friend are falling for the hype.

    Our economy will be fine…the matter is how long will this temporary crisis last? Oh as long as the Democratically controlled Congress take to allow for the offshore drilling to begin in order to bring the prices back down and our economy to begin to balance out again.

  189. Can God use Obama? What makes you think God isn’t using Obama, now?

    Thanks Joe for reposting the prophetic words telling about a man who was a Knight during our night.

    Let’s look at both men:

    John McCain was a soldier during the Vietnam War. This war took place in the ’60s. Yes, we had the Civil Rights movement; however this was also a time of major trouble within our country. I’d call it a time of darkness.

    Obama was never a soldier. As a lawyer, I’ve not heard of Obama fighting for this country. Though it would be pushing, a lawyer could be called a knight; however I don’t think we could put Obama in that category.

    What of intercession, I’ve not seen any indications of either Obama or McCain engaging in this activity. OTOH, Sarah Palin could be called a “prayer warrior” as it is a part of her life and the same is so of her husband and children.

    With this in mind, I’d definitely say that the alluded to Knight is John McCain.

  190. I’m done with this, we just have to wait till election day then. I wonder how people are going to spin things when Obama wins.

  191. Divine, did you check out billionsouls for christ? Believe what you want to believe but Obama is going to win. Once again, Kim’s prophecies are all over the place and therefore Inconclusive. You are clearly ignoring the prophecy Kim gave about Barack being elected president.

  192. Btw, why did they take down that particular prophecy Kim gave concerning Obama?

  193. Joey,

    Again, it shows that you are an ostrich with his head stuck in the sand. You are completely deluded and dishonest. You have shown by your attitude and constant denial that you are not interested in the TRUTH or what “GOD WANTS”….but what YOU want.

    YOu are obsessed with putting a foolish anti-Christ spirit in the WhiteHouse instead of putting in a “GODLY” Administration.

    You have completely ignored all the ‘multiple’ prophecies that Kim Clement has made along with the many other respected prophets that John McCain/Sara Palin are destined by God for the WhiteHouse. You completely ignore that.

    Then, you completely dodge the facts I put out about the Democrat Party and the Liberal Biased Media being guilty of political sabotage in an unclassy and inconsiderate attempt to sabotage the elections via deception.

    Finally, GOd is in control. He is the one showing Himself strong now. He is actually doing what He has always done through out history….make the devil look like a complete @ss by using his own weapons against him.

    God is the one who is using the treachery of the Democrat Party in their attempt to bring down the economy for the temporary season in order to make Bush look bad leading up to the elections and God is using this to bring down the prices of gas and making it cheaper for the poor to purchase stock and properties while the rich are freaking out and selling impulsively…

    Kim Clement mentioned this the other day on TBN. God is actually presenting the poor the opportunity to buy things that they were unable to before this and then when the economy goes back up….$cha-ching$!!!

    There are at least 8 prophecies that Kim has proclaimed that point to John McCain/Sara Palin being elected President/VP.

    The prophecies that you are taking out of context about Obama have to be distorted and privately interpreted into saying something else than what it is saying in order for you to pretend that it says what you want it to say. Kim Clement has already quelmed all doubts this past Saturday about those saying that he meant Obama was going to be elected…Kim clarified it by saying: NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Not what I said. I clearly have said the opposite.

    Kim has made it clear….but you continue to play pretense. Wow. You are a left wing fool. Decieved by the hype and lies and sabotage of the liberal media. Get real, repent, and get on the ‘right’ side. Amen.

  194. Then, Joe, who the heck is billionsoulsforchrist? a nobody who attacks other ministers. who is kimclement? only the most respected prophet of our time and proof proven. stephen odonga is just a man who is not proof proven and who is not respected and has stated that he doesn’t ‘know’ but that he had a “DREAM” that Obama was elected.

    Kim Clement has PROPHECIED over and over that McCain is going to be elected. Hello?

  195. Joe, so you are going to bank your “hope” in a DREAM by a no name man in England and bank “against” a PROPHECY that what, at least 5 well respected PROVEN PROPHETS have made???? That just mind boggles me. wow.

  196. Divine,

    Wowzers! You’re really heated up. But let’s realize this one thing, salvation will not come from either party. On the contrary, I believe the republican party is going to have to reset itself due to almost having no soul left. Unfortunately, our entire political system has shifted left. The republicans are now democrats and the democrats are now socialists. Who do we have left? Yeah, I like Palin and when asked what kind of political future she would like to have in the republican party, she didn’t sound all that excited. Come on, who’s really excited about most of the republican party anymore. Too many “conservatives” have morphed into gutless liberals so to feel excepted in Washington.

    I do hope what Kim has prophecied is true, not so much about who will be elected, but what God will do once they are elected. We need a serious mass damascus road encounter to take place in Washington. Either way, our mandate is the same: Spread the message. Spread the kingdom.

  197. Some place their trust in party ideologies: Democrats or Republican.

    Some place their trust in philosophical ideologies ala Liberalism and Conservatism.

    However, we will place our trust in God, Almighty.

    It should not matter if the proposed leader is a Liberal or a conservative. It is better to ask, “Is this person’s heart right before God”.

    If it had been Joe Leiberman running as a Dem and a Mitt Romney running as a Rep. Would you be asking “Who’s heart is open to God?” or we say “This one is too liberal! That one is a fine conservative!” I dare say that God may be looking more favorably on Sen. Joe Lieberman, an Orthodox Jew then Mitt Romney, a sincere Mormom.

  198. Thanks for beating me to the punch, Jacob. 🙂

    There is a danger when reading prophecies. Take care not to read your own personal biases into them. Is this not what the Jewish leaders did in regards to the promised Messiah? Did they not expect Messiah to come in as a military conqueror?

    They had the words of the prophets; however the leaders read the needs of the time and personal views into them. Even the disciples thought along a similar line.

    Take care when reading modern prophecies. You should ask questions. Better yet, prayerfully read them and bring your questions before God. It would also help to ask “Is this prophecy for the immediate future or down the road?” This is something I’m learning to do.

    Case in point, Kim Clement said some wonderful things about Hillary Clinton. Here it is:

    “January 14 2006: And some of you said, when the Spirit said Hillary Clinton , some of you shouted out “yes”. God said, I have already dealt with her heart, not to be President of this Nation but to be president in a Christian world. She will have a testimony second to none and will eventually come out with it and make declaration that Christ Jesus saved her marriage, saved her child, and saved her life. ”

    Here is the link:

    Let’s examine this in context of current event, shall we?

  199. LOL, Once again, Kim Clement’s prophecies are INCONCLUSIVE!!! He’s all over the place with his prophecies. Ridducle steve odonga all you want, but God uses the no names of this world to put to shame the popular. Obama is going to win this november and i’m sure you’ll have a lot of egg on your face. 🙂

  200. Btw, divine how come you NEVER provide links to these prophecies you claim to have come from Chuck Pierce, Bob Jones etc?

  201. Not so fast, joe.

    Let’s collectively examine this Clinton prophecy. It is quite possible to learn something.

    1. Please notice the date of the prophecy. It was given shortly before Jan 14 2006. During this time, there was much hype about Hillary running and winning the presidency. Ah the joys of listening to false prophets or prognosticators.

    Yes, she ran and sought her party’s nomination. She did NOT win the Democratic primary. Obama won this race. In the above prophecy, it is claimed that God dealt with her heart about being POTUS. How so? In what way? Is it possible that she will not seek to run for the Oval Office in 2012 after failing to win in 2008? Could it be that Hillary will only seek another term as US Senator?

    2. Hillary will tell of how God saved her marriage. Eh, I hate to break this but she already did this. There was an article on Fox News web site, early in 2008. She was telling a faith based group of voters of how God intervene in her marriage and saved it.

    3. ” President in a Christian world” sounds like something that will take place some years from now. She still has 4 more years as Senator of NY. This is assuming she doesn’t seek another term as Senator.


    For they have unfairly spoken against an African man, and I’m not talking about Jeremiah Wright; I’m talking about Obama. For God said, “Even though you may think this or that, there is an element of righteousness inside of him to reach out for Jesus. Therefore, I will sway it next week,” says the Spirit of God, “and I will cause My man, My power–to exalt in the White House what is necessary to declare victory. For this time, I shall rise up and I shall make known who I am in a way that I have never done it in this nation,” says the Lord.


    Spin it anyway you wan’t but this prophecy is CLEARLY talking about Obama winning the whitehouse.

  203. Okay,

    Let’s breakdown this Obama prophecy.

    Would it shock anyone that God would have a kind word to say baout Barack Obama or Hillary Clinton? For me, it is no surprise.

    First, let’s ask some questions.

    How was God talking to and about what?

    This prophecy is given in response to what was occurring with many Christians. The rebuke can easily include everyone; given how we were focused on Wright. We were also busy accusing Obama via guilt by association. Did anyone sought to pray for Barack in response to the poison being poured out?

    Did anyone notice that God says There is an element of righteousness that reaches for Jesus? We’re supposed to be praying for Barack and not codemning a man with accusations, true or not.

    I will sway it, next week. I am not sure of what is being referred to here. It may be that God was going to let Hillary win the nomination; however, He decided to have Barack win instead. <- I am guessing here.

    Remember, God loves BOTH John McCain and Barrack Obama. What God hates is the demonic strongholds placed in Barack’s life. Strongholds that needs to come down. Yes, I am aware of the sins in his life. It is why it is good to pray for the guy.

    It may well be that Barack will be the African American president; however it will be at a future date. Please recall the Clinton prophecy. Hillary is to be president in a Christian world. This has not happened. It is a future prophecy.

  204. Joe, Barry, Divine and all else,

    I tell you what guys. Just for laughs and giggles let’s all come back the day after the election and talk about this. It will be interesting to see how we read, misread, put too much trust in, or not enough trust into all these prophecies. Maybe we can learn a thing or two about how to better approach, and discern modern day prophecies in the future. Also, we could all learn a little something about humility as well, when declaring bold “Thus saith the Lord’s” from everyone we hear. Personally, I’d like to see a little more scriptural instruction on how to handle and discern the prophetic in the body of Christ as a whole.

  205. Barry, God “does” matter about Liberalism and Conservatism. Liberalism is the pagan world ideology, while Conservativism is the Judeo-Christian ideology. This is just common knowledge. Why would God be “against” His own Word?

    What Kim Clement has prophecied is about not being “Partisan”. Big difference from liberalism and conservatism. Lieberman is a “conservative” Democrat. Notice he himself has stated that the Democrat Party has been sabotaged by the extreme left and become a socialist anti-Judeo Christian Party.

    So, yes, God is going to be concerned about that. Don’t kid yourself.

    God saving a liberal is great and I pray and hope for that night and day…but not going to deceive myself into voting for someone in ‘hope’ of this.

    Right now, I pray for both McCain and Obama. But they have free wills, and banking on the salvation of both is not what I am going to base my vote on…but on what they are representing for the future, now.

  206. Joe,

    We are talking about popularity here. you are so immature its laughable. Kim is “respected” as a Prophet of the Lord, for a reason. Odonga is “not”, for a reason too.

    Its not about popularity, this election has you confused and misinformed. Clement’s prophecies have come to pass, therefore the respect world wide.

    Odonga is someone who started a website and stated that he doesn’t know, but that he had a DREAM that Obama became president? Duh, look at the media bombardment with and obsession with the guy…is it a surprise that one would have a dream like that? C’mon, please.

  207. Joe,


    “GOT IT?” Go to his website, he still has the Saturday webcast on the website to play and see. He is clearly explaining that HE NEVER PROPHECIED OBAMA BEING OUR PRESIDENT THERE AT ALL.

    He confirms that he has prophecied about McCain being the one.

    Why do you continue to SPIN IT THE WAY YOU WANT IT?

    A sincere spirit wants to NOT SPIN IT and wants to know THE TRUTH. You my friend, are an embarrassment. YOu care not for the TRUTH, but only to spin and see what you want….DESPITE KIM’S OPENLY AND CLEARLY DISSPELLING THAT FALSE ACCUSATION.

    Repent dude.

  208. Jacob,

    I don’t think its much about humility nor about putting trust in prophecies. The Bible tells us not to despise prophecies and to use discernment when judging.

    What we are doing right now. Kim Clement is again a respected prophet of God. If this turns out to be a false prophecy about John McCain being elected then it will hurt his credibility and he wouldn’t be able to be trusted.

    In fact, Kim stated this very thing this past Saturday on the live webcast when answering the question that the viewer had about why it seemed that he was endorsing both candidates.

    Kim stated again, as I’ve been urging Joe(not the plumber 🙂 ) to go to the website and catch the webcast that is still available to watch…that he never endorsed Obama but that the prophecy that people have confused and misinterpretated into suggesting such a thing was Kim prophecying to Christians about that God loves Obama “too”.

    Kim confirmed that his prophecies have shown which one God has revealed to him is God’s pick to take us to the banning of Roe v Wade, John McCain.

    Kim then adds that if he is wrong…”….this piano won’t be here next year, these cameras, and he will not continue being a prophet.

    However, of course, if what he has prophecied about the man that “…they will say he has HOT BLOOD…” about and the man that “…they will say what of the AGE? will one die in office?” about…

    wins the election, then all will know that we have a Prophet of God among us.

    Then, I’m just pointing out that other prophets, not all, but the ones that are well RESPECTED as having made numerous prophecies that have come to pass have prophecied the confirmation: (Let it be by two or more witnesses that something is established)…about McCain being elected President.

    This is in the scriptures about Prophets and prophecy. Let’s follow it.

  209. Divine,

    Joe Lieberman said what about the Democratic Party? Yes, I did not know that he said it has become such. When did he say this?

    I found it interesting to hear you say that “Conservatism” is the same as Judeo-Christian” value. With the exception of social conservatism, I generally don’t get that impression.

    Don’t worry, I do see modern liberalism as just plain secular humanism.

    For me, I see myself as a left leaning moderate and an Independent. I said left leaning because I’m more interested in showing compassion and mercy. I have a hard time seeing conservatives as such. Because I’m part of the disabled community, I started as a Dem then registered as a Republican when I saw the antics after the 2000 election. Since then, I decided to just be an Independent.

  210. Divine,

    It’s true that most equate christian evangelicalism as A PART of conservatism. Definitely the “anything goes” pagan culture is known to be a big part of liberalism. There are other issues that separate the two such as fiscal and foreign policies. All in all I think your right. There is nothing wrong with using these words because they are known by most as real cultural movements that are waging war against each other. We call this a “spiritual war” that is being waged for the soul of the nation. Those who are not discerning spiritual things would call it conservatism and liberalism only.

    As far as being a republican and a democrat, I agree with Barry on this one. God doesn’t care. These are just names that don’t mean anything…especial nowadays.

  211. Ok, I’ve had it! Let’s settle this once and for all with who should be in the White House. Watch the following video and I think you guys will finally wise up!

  212. Divine, Joe liberman IS NOT a conservative democrat. He is pro choice, pro gay marriage, the only thing that sets him apart from dems is the iraq issue. Like i said before, i’ll be back here after the elections to help you clean that egg off your face. 🙂

  213. Barry,

    Google Joe Lieberman and search it out. He has been on various interviews on multiple networks stating that the reason he ran as an Independent in 2006 and the reason he is supporting John McCain and why he supports our President, GW Bush is because the leftist extreme liberals have taken over the Democratic Party and have become so partisan and don’t care for the well being of our nation.

    Joe Lieberman has mentioned many times over. It has actually been a part of his campaign in Connecticut.

    Then, secular humanism is the religious ideology of the liberal. Judeo-Christian principles is the ideology of the conservative. It’s what separates the two sides.

    The left doesn’t respect the Bible, they want it out of schools and public life. This is evidenced by their statements and numerous attempts to rid public life and even political life of the “Bible’s” God.

    The right have always been known for the side that “favors” the “Bible’s” God. So yes, liberalism is secular humanism. And yes, conservatives are the pro-Judeo Christian value system.

    Thus, why they favor banning abortions, banning gay marriage and the liberals favor abortions and favor promoting the gay agenda.

    Liberals are “not” merciful. Quite the opposite. They are secular humanists and don’t believe in “moral absolutes” so they want to allow free sex and free anarchy type of living. That’s not mercy.

    That’s a guise. No, mercy is actually a part of conservatism. Pro God is pro mercy. Pro Family is pro mercy.

    Liberals are intolerable of anything BIBLE. Conservatives are “tolerable” of even misinformation like evolution but want liberals to “tolerate” creation and those who don’t believe as them.

    So you see who really is pro mercy. Liberals are seen all the time on TV, schools, on internet forums just insulting Chrisians and those who don’t believe in the fantasy island stuff that they do. Liberals ridicule anyone who doesn’t believe as they do. Liberals judge and angrily with a spirit of bigotry jus lash out on those who are pro family and pro life and pro Bible.

    Conservatives always show respect to the other side with patience but want to exercise their rights to live a wise and moral life. Liberals don’t want this. They are “intolerant” and too biggotted to do this.

    In fact, liberals are so afraid of the truth and of the Bible that they refuse to allow fair debates in schools and only insist on indoctrinating our students with lies instead of allowing for the student to judge for themselves.

    No. You have a completely misinformed view on what liberalism really is.

  214. Joe, you are an embarrassment. I actually blush after I read much of what you post. Don’t you think you should grow up a little before you make a complete @ss of yourself?

    Dude, repent and seek the Lord, because you obviously do not know Him and/or care about what His Will is. You just think things up and want them to be that way. Pitiful.

    Again, you have already shown that you are dishonest and insincere in your posts and questions you pose. You have no interest in what God wants, but in want YOU want. It is quite distasteful.

    Egg? Who the heck is talking about eggs? Pfft. Dude, we are talking about something serious and important: the upcoming elections and what God has spoken regarding the issue.

    You are still busy worrying about throwing eggs at people’s faces and just playing an in denial attitude toward all of this. Grow up. This is a matter for grown up folk.

  215. McGreger,

    Thanks for the video man. That’s totally opened my eyes to what’s really going on. You may have just changed my mind when I enter the voting booth.

  216. Divine, Barry,

    Joe Liberalman along with many others, is exactly what I mean by the republican party being completely deluted and needing to be reset. It’s great that he’s supporting McCain…or is it. Heck, let’s be honest here, McCain and Liberalman are just about the same. I hate to say this but the conservative tent has been so stretched to make room for for godlessness that it has now been torn. If the republican ship must go down in the sea of mediocrity, then let it go down. Don’t try to save it and patch it up with a pretty facade. We are kingdom people, not politicians. The political spirit always eventually kills any real substance of morality, because the political spirit craves power no matter what party it attached to.

  217. Jacob,

    What you’re saying for the Republican Party can easily apply to the Democrats. Factionalism is tearing these two apart! No wonder Pres. George Washington warned the nation about the danger of political parties. Yes, I found it in his farewell letter that can be found on the Internet.

    I did some research into our country’s political history. Both parties need a major reset. They’ve strayed very far from where they originally started.


    I give you an irony. Did you know the original liberals in this country were Christians? They were found in both parties. They were the advocates for changes in the 1800s and 1900s. At the same time, we’re called to preserve what is right and true. This is the essence of conservatism.

    Somehow, there was shift. Instead of relying on God’s power and provisions. there came into both parties a reliance upon self. Instead of looking to the Bible for moral guidance and letting the Scripture act as a moral compass; an an anything goes mentality attached itself to both parties. It is just more obvious in the Democratic Party then the Republican Party.


    I have a simple question for you. Why are you so gung ho for Obama to win? I, for one would love to see the racial wounds in this country healed. Yet, it must be done at the heart level. Obama becoming President would certainly be symbolic of this; however it must begin at the heart level. In a large degree, this requires repentance.

  218. Divine, give me a break with your self righteousness!! You apparently put conservatism and prophets before Jesus. It is christian rightwingers like you that turn people off from the gospel.All im saying is that, all these republican leaning prophets have always prophecied in past elections that a republican was going to win. Check out the 1992 and 1996 elections, they all prophecies that Bole dole was going to win, there was no way God was going to led Clinton Win the presidency but yet look who won? Didn’t Clinton have the same positions as Barack Obama back then? Yet God allowed him to win over a so called pro-life, anti-gay marriage republican war hero. Barry do you know why i wan’t Obama to win? Look at the state of the economy, the stupid war we are fighting in iraq, the healthcare problems in this country. I know for a fact that a McCain presidency is not going to make gay marriage illegal, heck is is even against a constitutional ammendment banning gay marriage and abortion. He want’s it left to the states to decide if abortion and gay marriage should be illegal or not. All of you who claim you are voting for McCain ONLY because of moral issues ARE LYING. Apart from the “moral” issues, you like his views on the economy, war, health care etc. Even if Obama was “pro-life”, against gay marriage, you WOULD NOT vote for him because of his liberal views on other issues important to Americans. Divine your so called right wing politicians are as immoral as they come. Look at david vitter, larry craig, Foley, Gingrich, McCain etc. They all engaged in sexually immoral behavior, cheating on their wifes, sleeping with prostitutes. You are IGNORANT if you think somehow conservatives are “holy” and perfect.

  219. It seems Divine isn’t the only hothead around here. 🙂 Both, Divine and Joe, need to take a step back and chill. You’re arguing with a spirit of accusation. This isn’t the best way to bring about change and conviction.


    You must have missed my earlier post. I am not a conservative. I am a left leaning moderate. I prefer godly solution to problems relating to abortion. It won’t go away if we just overturn Roe v. Wade. It would be nice if the church would step up with offering adoption and helping with welfare. Actually, we need to be a lot more visible than we are now. As it is, I tend to think it is good for the government to step up to the plate and help.

    I registered originally with the Democratic Party because I saw them as being more interested in the needs of minority groups. The Republicans seem more interest corporate America and its needs. Oh how they’ve changed! I am now an Independent.

    BTW, I give you yet another irony. Guess which party started out as being for State Rights. It wasn’t the Republicans. They started out as being for a strong central government. That is right, they were Federal Rights. The Dems were the one espousing a State Rights platform. Oh how things have changed!

  220. Joe,

    You gots to stop your lying. You’ve deceived yourself in the process. Kim Clement never prophecied Bob Dole was going to win. You just made that up. You have become so pitiful that what you say matters nothing anymore.

    How’s this for a link. Open up your eyes…you’ve been duped.

  221. Divine,

    So basically, Kim Clement is saying that if McCain doesn’t become president he’s going to pack up his piano and go home? No more prophesying for the Kimster?

  222. Divine doesn’t provide any links or text to back up anything he says. Give us a direct link to all these prophecies by Bob Jones, Chuck Pierce and Kim saying specifically that McCain is going to be president. You CAN’T!!

  223. In regards to Bob Jones, the only prophetic words I’ve heard is this.

    In 2008, God will place a man of righteousness in the White House; IF THE CHURCH WOULD PRAY HIM IN. It is conditional and based on the Church praying for this person. Bob Jones said this, long before Barrack Obama showed up. Nobody knew who was going to run, at the time. Hillary Clinton was just speculation.

    Bob’s admonition to the church was largely seen through email. Do not know if it is on his site:

    Haven’t heard of Chuck Pierce saying anything; however Dutch did say that we should never assume that God has changed his mind on issues like abortion.

    He was quite careful to NOT mention either candidates; however, he felt uneasy about one person’s gift for public speaking. Gee, he should have just said Obama. Nevertheless, Dutch has good reasons not to. You can find this on Dutch Sheets web site. I think it was given in August and before the Palin surprise.

    Lou Engles does say something about Sarah Palin and it is on his web site. Just go to and see for your self.

  224. louengle also thought brownback was going to win the presidency. Next..all these people are injecting their personal political preference in these prophetic words.

    Billionsoulsforchrist, that guy is not even American and has no biases. He gave that dream/prophecy way before Obama even ran for president.

  225. Sam Brownback? Actually, Lou thought it was going to be Mike Huckabee. He wrote about it, back in February ’08. He didnt say that God told him Mike would be nominated.

    Lou said that he thought it was Mike based on what God has told him. Lou was being quite honest about his interpretation.

    It seems that you’re wanting Barack only for the purpose of mocking other people. It isn’t a good strategy.

    I have my own reservations when reading a prophecy like Kim or others. It is only due to a natural tendency to hear what you want. This is why it is so important to prayerfully read the prophecy and bring it to God. It is also good to reread it.

  226. Joe,

    This discussion involved those who already know about Kim Clement, Chuck Pierce, Dutch Sheets, Hank Kunneman websites. The thread was opened about Kim Clement’s prophecies about the next President. So we were discussing the prophecies.

    Those in this discussion were supposed to be Christians who “already knew” Kim Clement’s websites. So there was no need for us to presume that a “Joe Shmoe” was going to get in the discussion never had heard none of these prophets before. Thus why if we mention Kim Clement’s webcast this past Saturday, we assume those in the discussion know where to go and access it. the prophet who is the apostle or overseer of Chuck Pierce and travels and preaches with Pierce mentions the service where they spoke about Sarah Palin in America’s prophetic destiny.

    Going through all the prophecies in the website of Kim Clement will get you all you need in order to catch up to the prophecies of the next President from Clement. has Hank Kunneman’s prophecy of John McCain’s electing as President.

    Finally, we have already established that you are not sincere. Your questions are not sincere questions and you are not interested in the “truth”. So why waste time giving you links?

    If you were sincerely interested in who “God” said He wanted to instate in the Oval Office, you wouldn’t be continually in denial about the prophecies and continually spew your irrational and demonic hate towards our President and the Republican Party.

    You have shown that you just want to believe what “you” want to believe regardless what Kim Clement has prophecied or any other “proven” prophet has confirmed.

    No, you choose to spew irrational, foolish, untrue, super-silliest, holier than thou hateful rhetoric. You pick and choose anything that will say what “you” want it to say and expect us to take you seriously?

    You continue to ignore who God has said is going to be President of the USA and now are bandwagoning with a mere “dream” that some non prophet had about someone that “you” want to elect President and you use that as if it held any weight? LMAO.

    Kim Clement already prophecied Katrina before Katrina even started. Kim prophecied about 911 five years before it happened.

    Kim prophecied GW Bush was going to be elected and re-elected though the media was doing what they are doing now for Obama for Gore and Kerry. To no avail. Bush won both times.

    Now Kim has prophecied that John McCain was going to be our President before the primaries even began…matter of fact, in the beginning of 2007 he prophecied about the one who “they will say he has HOT BLOOD…” and about the one who “FOUGHT for you in your nights…”

    then after the media frenzy with Obama Kim still prophecied in July of the one who “they will say what of the AGE? will one die in office?”

    Yet you choose to ignore that and go with a dream that a none prophet had? Wow.

    So, no. I don’t need to waste time giving you links that are already up and down this thread of the prophet’s websites.

    If you haven’t heard the prophets speak, don’t speak about what they are speaking.

  227. Kim, Just because someone isn’t paraded on tv doesn’t make them a “non prophet”. I have looked through and there is no prophecy indicating that John McCain is going to win the elections. Again, as arguing before the results come out is pretty stupid isn’t it? If John McCain wins, then these prophets heard from God but If Barack wins, then they have some serious explanation to do.

  228. Joe,

    Throughout the history of civilizations, it usually is moral bankruptcy that actually brings a nation down. Studying the history of the downfall of Rome would be a great exercise. Right now, in the natural, we are staring into the abyss of some pretty scary stuff that some fear could distroy this nation or at least greatly bring us into some very dark times.

    So let me ask you this, what will be the cause of the undoing of this nation in your opinion? Many look at surface issues when thinking about this, especially when it effects our wallets. So, is it a bad economy, not having universal health care, gas prices or Bush tax cuts that will be our demise? See, this is the problem, these are all surface issues we see only in the natural and we scream injustice when it starts to pinch us in our pocket books. We do not even consider that maybe something like the greatest injustice of our time since slavery may be holding us back from the blessings of God as a nation. I’m talking about the mass extermination of the unborn.

    I’ve begun to do some studying concerning the slavery days, who opposed it, who was for it, and how we overcame it. I believe many of the same attitudes of denial and justification that was found in slavery we are seeing now with the “pro-choicers.” I know people are tired of hearing about this but I’m not going to see this nation go down without a fight. It’s time to draw some lines. Who are the sheep and who are the goats? God will soon bring us into a valley of decision that will either lead us into live or death as a nation, since we have played with the life and death of the innocent unborn. This IS the slavery issue of our time. I do not advocate a new civil war to bring about this change, but truly a civil war has been raging in our nation in the hearts and minds of Americans for decades now. Our national sovereignty is quickly being taken from us as we continue in our sin, and we’re worried about a universal health care that everyone knows we can’t even pay for. Joe, here is the prescription to our problems.

    “If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.” (2 Chronicles 7:14)

    Once we do this, then we can talk tax policies, health care and the like. Otherwise, in my opinion, this is like saying the economy was more important than slavery back in the day.

  229. Barry,

    You see now why I have been standing my ground with Joe? Some of us realize the implications of this election. The attack on Christianity and our freedoms and the attempt to usher in the anti-Christ and his system and the throwing in jail and violation of our constitutional freedoms by electing Obama.

    See the video on about Prop8 and see how important a day we are in and the civil war that is upon us. We the Christians are the modern day black slaves. Our freedoms are being attacked by the modern day KKK( the Leftwing Liberal Democrats).

    If we want to keep our religious freedoms and the right to follow God and the right to live godly lives….we MUST VOTE FOR JOHN MCCAIN/SARA PALIN and stop Obama from bringing what is happening to the Christian families in Massachusetts. The sad state of terrorism within our own court system against the people of God.

    By allowing people like Joe to be airheads about the state of attack on our God and our lives and freedoms we have allowed the homosexuality out of the closet and by doing so…WE are now being threatened to be forced in the closet!

    We must stand up and FIGHT, just like the Republicans did during the Civil War…or our freedoms will be taken away from us.

    One more point. People continue to fall for the lies about “God isn’t for Republicans”.

    Yes, he is when the Democrat Party has stood up “against” Him and His Word.

    Right now, God chose GW BUsh(a Republican) for the simple fact that he was willing to stand up for Christians.

    Dr Martin Luther King Jr was a REPUBLICAN. Abraham Lincoln was a REPUBLICAN. GW BUSH was a REPUBLICAN. JOHN MCCAIN/SARA PALIN are REPUBLICANS….and they are FOR Christian’s freedoms and the family’s right to raise their children.

    Obama and the Democrat Party are intellectually raping our children from a young age…see the video of Prop8 on

  230. Divine,

    I just visited Lou’s website just now and read his latest blog comparing slavery the slavery issue with the abortion issue. Here it is for anyone to read.

    The thing is, I hadn’t read this yet until you said to go to his website. This is exactly what I was posting before I read his blog. I think that’s definitely a conformation about what we are facing right now.

  231. Jacob,

    I read Lou’s blog entry and it is dead on! A talk with a friend has gotten me thinking about the connection between the racial wounds in our country and abortion. Lou went into greater details. Now, I can say “Whoa!”.


    I only care about where the person’s heart is before God. I don’t care about Party loyalty. If I did, I wouldn’t consider John McCain. BTW, what of FDR who saw us through The Great Depression and WWII? What of Harry Truman and JFK? They are all Democrats. I’d also include LBJ, as well.

  232. We don’t need McCain to be elected president for God to bring revival about in this country. Once again, what has changed since Bush became president for 8 years? Has gay marriage been banned? Has abortio been make illegal? Wake up people, the republicans are just using you for your votes. Me and millions of others are going to vote for Obama because we know that God can and will use him to turn this country around.

    “If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.” (2 Chronicles 7:14)

    Jacob, i guess the above verse only holds true if McCain gets elected as president right? *rolls eyes*

  233. LOL, divine your writings resemble the rantings of a lunatic. We get it now, all republicans are holy and perfect and democrats are evil and sons of the devil LMAO

  234. No Joe. It applies to matter what happens. Get the chip off your shoulder.

  235. Joe,

    So what is this? Since nothing’s changed in eight years, let’s just give up the fight? You and I still have a voice. This country is still empowered by “We the people.” Since it was the supreme court that started this, it will probably take the supreme court to end this…but this takes time. It will take time to shift the supreme court with the right righteous judges. Though I do not agree with all that Bush has done, this one thing he has done right, in shifting the supreme court.

    BTW, thanks for twisting what I have said about republicans. You know my disdain and feeling with the republican party right now. It’s all on this thread.

    You’re response concerning abortion was weak and pathetic. What if you had said these things about slavery, that nothing has changed so let’s just keep voting for the pro-slavery guys. Come on Joe, grow a spine. What side are you on, not concerning republican/democrat but concerning life and death. I know we are getting used by the republicrats concerning abortion, but what are you going to do Joe? Give up? I’m not going to throw away my core convictions because some use them for political gain. Let’s be the “We the people” country we were meant to be and vote the fakes out of office but in the mene time the slaves are still working the cotton fields. What are you going to do Joe?

  236. Jacob,

    It seems we’re on the same wavelength. I tend to take a cynical view of the Republican party when it comes to the issue of abortion.

    It will be quite interesting to see both parties reactions when they see just how important this issue is to Christians in both parties. We just can’t have a guy is is totally for it.

    Is God using Barack Obama, though he isn’t God’s choice? Yes, he is. I visited and saw what was said of this election. Obama is being used to pave the way for an African American president in the future. Thanks to his candidacy, we’re seeing a lot of changes.Just as God was using Ferraro and Clinton to pave the way for Palin, God is using Barack Obama.

  237. Jacob, do you think the Apostles and other great reformers had the luxury of man made laws to help them with revival? This is a spiritual issue, and to think you can bring some kind of change through physical laws is fallacy. Obama is not going to throw any christians in jail or take away anyone’s freedom of religion. These baseless fearmongering claims are not going to work this time around in the election. Vote for McCain and then what? Pass his plan of leaving abortion to the states?

    Concerning the OVM prophecy, i’m just not buying it. He had a prophecy saying a man of peace would be elected president some time back, but i have seen he has removed that part. Chuck pierce and some other Prophetic people gave this prophecy concerning who is going to be president next year. READ it and tell me they are talking about McCain or even Palin. Btw, i found this prophecy from Cindy Jacob’s website.


    God has provided a righteous man who will begin to emerge towards the end of ’07 and begin to shine in ’08. We will not be left scratching our heads or feeling like we are throwing our vote away on someone who cannot win, but God will put His very apparent light of favor upon this man and we will know how to pray and how to vote.


    Didn’t Obama suddenly come out of nowhere and begin to shine in 2008? You people might not think he’s righteous, but apparently God sees things differently.

  238. The Apostolic Council of Prophetic Elders
    C. Peter Wagner, Cindy Jacobs, Chuck Pierce and others,,


    United States
    The United States has been saved from those who would remove God from its borders, but now the nation must be established. There is a four-year window for the intercessors to war for the establishment of morality and righteousness. God is going to raise up a president in 2008 who will reconcile the nations to the United States. Bush has been called to be a man of war, like David, but God is bringing a Solomon to the office in ’08 who will make peace with the nations.

    I have noticed you guys don’t want to address the prophecies that don’t point to McCain or Palin as president.

    WE ALL KNOW THAT MCCAIN IS JUST LIKE BUSH, I.E- A MAN OF WAR!!! Obama is wise and smart and he is for peace, thus the prophecy refering to him as the solomon in Office.

  239. God has provided a righteous man who will begin to emerge towards the end of ’07 and begin to shine in ’08. We will not be left scratching our heads or feeling like we are throwing our vote away on someone who cannot win, but God will put His very apparent light of favor upon this man and we will know how to pray and how to vote

    Remember McCain had been running for president since after he lost the nomination to Bush in 2000. So this prophecy is clearly talking about Obama who just came from no where in 2007 .

  240. Joe,

    Ok bro, I don’t seem to be communicating my heart very well so here’s my last attempt and then I’m done with this.

    1. True, the apostles did not have this luxary but it does matter to God. Just read in Acts 12:23 about what happened to King Herod. He became a worm sandwich. “When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice: but when the wicked beareth rule, the people mourn.” (Proverbs 29:2) It DOES matter to God.

    2. I never said McCain was the man to bring revival or a godly man. Listen to me Joe, I DO NOT LIKE MCCAIN! However, I am voting for Palin. Looking at her record, she is probably the most hardcore pro-lifer, family values, pro-evangelical christian out there. She’s even made fun of for her “extreme” record.

    3. As far as Obama goes, he is the most stonch pro-abortion candidate the democrats have ever picked. My position is this, though I am not a left leaning person, I would vote for Obama in a heart beat if he was pro-life, not pro-gay rights, and didn’t publically mock the Bible. So yes, even though I am a fiscal conservative, I would vote for Obama if he would stand up for me as an evangelical christian.

    You say this –
    “This is a spiritual issue, and to think you can bring some kind of change through physical laws is fallacy.”

    Yet you quote the following prophecy –
    “The United States has been saved from those who would remove God from its borders, but now the nation must be established. There is a four-year window for the intercessors to war for the establishment of morality and righteousness. God is going to raise up a president in 2008 who will reconcile the nations to the United States. Bush has been called to be a man of war, like David, but God is bringing a Solomon to the office in ‘08 who will make peace with the nations.”

    I thought presidents couldn’t change anything. I thought it was all “fallacy” as you put it. Which is it Joe?

    If you can’t get what I’m saying that’s fine but I’m done with this issue. Either way, be blessed Joe.

  241. Obama never publically mocked the Bible. That’s another lie from the anti-Obama crowd. Again, you refused to adress the prophecies i posted on here. I wonder why.

  242. Wow, Joe, is showing more and more how mentally handicap he is!!!

    Not one of those prophecies he used pointed to WHO the next President is. “YOU” just filled in the blanks, (which contradict the prophecy by the way) to say what YOU are saying it is saying.

    No, OVM.ORG very CLEARLY says:



  243. jOE,

    Yes, Obama publicly ridiculed the Bible. He called Pennsylvanians “Bible thumping, gun loving, cling to there Bible, empty headed, Christians!” Mcfly?

  244. And Joe,

    I’m sick and tired of you Liberals sticking your foot out for the President to trip and fall….and then critizing him for falling!!!!

    Have you not noticed that the Democrat Party controls the Congress? How can GW Bush get a law banning abortion passed if the majority of the Congress won’t pass it! Same with the gay marriage issue!

    Then, GW BUSH has appointed 2 PRO-LIFE justices to our Supreme Court bringing us closer to overturning Roe v Wade. …so how do you figure that he hasn’t done anything to ban abortion? He’s done the only thing that he “could” do!!! Be consistent. Stop your lies.

    Repent. Stop fighting against God….that’s called “anti-Christ”.

  245. Hey Joe,

    I’ve been to all those websites that you provided links and they “ALL” are the very prophets who have prophecied that John McCain is God’s choice and that America’s prophetic destiny is coming from “ALASKA”!


    Notice that the Liberal Democrats all they do is just ridicule and misinform the masses about the Conservative Republicans. Because they want POWER.

    Republicans show points, undeniable points and facts about the issues. All Liberal Democrats do is just ridicule and talk bad about the other side.

    They will say yes to everything in order to get voted in. Because they don’t have any points on issues.

    They get angry when Republicans call them out on their lies and deceptions and Marxist agenda because they don’t want the public to know what they REALLY stand for….

    No, all they do is just insult the other side with no class. They bombard us with Hollywood, the media, and public schools and college professors but won’t make any points because they have none.


  246. Hey Prophet Julie Meyers has just added a prophecy during a meeting as well to who God has chosen and what is God doing about our upcoming elections:

  247. Also another prophecy:

  248. Riddle me this? Did Pres. George W. Bush start out as a “man of war”? Since David’s youth, he has been a warrior. This is not the case for King Solomon. Solomon was known for his wisdom and just decisions. He was largely a “man of peace”. That is how he grew up.

    John McCain has been a warrior since his youth. So, I ask you this, how then can the Spirit say “a man of peace”?

  249. Divine, then the prophecies are inconclusive aren’t they? These people are giving prophecies all over the place. Chuck pierce and others can’t prophecy early on about a solomon or a man of peace winning and then prophecy later on about A McCain win. Even though i haven’t seen any chuck pierce prophecy about McCain winning anything. So tell me divine, is McCain a man of peace? You hang all your hopes on Hank Kunneman like he’s infallible, but he’s also just a man afterall. He also had a prophecy about a man of peace winning the election but he took it off his website.

    As for Obama talking about people clinging to their religion in a time of hardship…what is wrong with that? Shouldn’t christians be happy to be EVEN recognized as clinging to our Bibles and God? To say that statement means that Obama is ridiculing the Bible is very Dumb.

  250. Divine, i watched the Julie meyers videos and God never said anything about McCain winning. Julie meyers said if people pray then then McCain can win. All i see is julie injected her personal political preferences in these words.

    Btw, julie is a worship leader not a prophet. Just because someone prophecies don’t make them a prophet.

  251. Divine and Barry,

    Since we’ve got Joe Sixpack and Joe the Plumber, I think we can add another Joe. How ’bout Joe the Brick Layer. Guys, ya’ll are wasting your breath with Joe the Brick Layer. His brick wall is inmoveable no matter what you say. He want’s to argue. This is what feeds him. He needs it to feel important. I’d move on to more constructive conversation and ignore Joe the Brick Layer.

  252. McGreger,

    🙂 You got a point!

    Thanks to Divine, I did a study on the platforms of the two currently dominant political parties. I’d also took some time to read what George Washington, John Adams and Thomas Jefferson said in some of their public documents.

    I was never sure of where they were spiritually, but I can see that Washington & Adams appear to be Christians. Jefferson did believe in God; except that he was a Deist.

    I am trying to get a picture of how they saw the role of faith, the State and Church. One thing is, they’ve drawn a distinction between faith and Church.

  253. Barack Obama will be elected

    President of the United States of America Nov 4, 2008

  254. Divine

    you need to get real

  255. Kim,

    Wow, that’s real substantive. (roll eyes)

  256. Divine,

    Kim’s looking for a reaction, you took the bait. What is there to win? We need to move on to more important things, like watching Spongebob tonight with my daughter.

  257. Some sobering thoughts. Please view the following video. Pray for the church and our nation.

  258. I am not sure if this is a case of me just wanting to say it, or what. It came to my mind to talk about my particular view.

    I was born with severe hearing loss and am very nearsighted. It doesn’t help to have a slight facial paralysis. When my parents sought to enroll me in the public school system in 1970; they were quite grateful for the school being progressive in their view of people with severe disabilities.

    Over the years, I have been blessed with getting to know some wonderful open minded people; especially in my college days. I thank God for them and their positive influence. In college, I learned that these individuals were to some degree called “Liberal”. I didn’t get to know the “fringes”.

    In college, I also was introduced to “conservatives”, both religious and economic conservatives. Yikes!! There may well have been social conservatives mixed in. These guys were some of the most discouraging bunch I’ve met. They did not strike me as being very open and accepting of me.

    Some had difficulty with me being in college. Why? Would they rather stick in a factory, instead? Yes, I do know about discrimination and it is quite real. That last statement should point to another problem I’ve had with conservatives.

    Don’t worry, I am aware that there are liberals who have acted badly to people with disabilities. Yet, when it came to reforming our American society, I have found that it is the moderates that leans both left and right that has done the most good. Reforms didn’t come from either the right or the left. It came from those who’ve said, “How can we make life better?” “How can we remove barriers that keeps the disabled community from participating in society?” Very seldom does this come from conservatives.

    Feel free to comment.

  259. Barry,

    I cannot speak for “conservatives” but I know that my local church has been the most caring for those with disabilities. I don’t know your church background, wether you have been burned or neglected in the body of Christ before. Again, though a big part of “conservatism” has a big emphesis on christian evangelicalism, they are not one and the same. I found a study done recently saying that conservatives actually give more to charity than liberals, though I admit I don’t have the numbers. You may want to find the study yourself online but this leads to my point on conservatism and compassion. Here is the difference.

    1. Liberalism says the government should be the one to take care of the ill’s of society. The downside is, when government gets involved, it usually means they do it more ineffeciantly and they end up taking over more of our personal lives and freedoms in the process. Case in point: If we finally get a universal health care system, the governement will then have to say who is eligable for what kind of care. Also, just look at the other countries such as Great Britian who has tried this. It has failed, and recently Great Britian has had to start moving away from the nationalized health care idea. It was run so ineffeciently that people wait on a list for months for major surguries that here in the U.S. would take days. The same is true in Canada. Liberalism usually starts out with good intentions but then in the end it enslaves the very people they are trying to help. Just look at the wellfare state in many liberal run places in the country such as New Orleans, and Detroit. Another example: After Katrina all levels of government failed to help the displaced. It was the church that did a way better job and did a way more effecent job. Liberals have been in power for decades their, and they are the poorest, most inslaved people to the welfare system in America. See, the scripture says, “So let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver” (2 Corinthians 9:7). Forced giving to the government or to anyone is not the compassion God has called us to. Actually, this is the very heart of the “new covenant.” An internal work done by the Holy Spirit that shows fruit of Good works outwardly. The “old covenant” used external pressures to get us to be good and do good stuff.

    2. Conservatism says get the government out of my way. Let me keep more of my money, so I can give more to the poor, charity and my church. At least this is the heart of the “conservative” churches and christians that I’ve always known. Also, if I get to keep more of my money, I’ll have more to spend on things like the health insurance of my choice. See, conservatism is a lot about choice and freedom. As a christian, giving “choices” and “freedoms” all started in the garden of Eden. This is the heart of God, not to force us to love Him or anyone else but out of a willful heart.

    This was also the heart of the founding fathers. They were more Libertarian than anything else. They feared government, and warned us of “government with good intentions” that would eventually grow into an oppressive state. This is why they escaped from Great Britian. Let’s ALLOW compassion to flow from the heart of people and not from a power hungery government that will just create bigger problems in the end. Remember, what we allow the government to do to “help” society, they must also take over. There are always strings attached.

  260. One last thought. Does the government have any place in assisting or helping the disable. Absolutely! Only as it falls under this criteria. We gaurateed “The pursuit of live, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.” Not happiness which is what liberalism always promises but never delivers, but the “pursuit” of happiness. In another words, the government has a resposiblity to ensure the disabled has the full oppurtunity to access happiness, but not nessessarily happiness itself.

  261. I know that the government can’t give “happiness”. I actually don’t want them to give but rather help in the pursuit.

    When I read your slightly earlier post, I couldn’t help but notice a streak of cynicism rising up. This isn’t from the Spirit; rather it is coming from my flesh. The cynical thought goes like this, “I really don’t trust the private sector. The government needs to step in and ensure fairness.” FWIW, I tend to not include the Church with “private sector”.

    I, for one, do not want the government to do everything, as they can’t. The same is true of the “private sector”. I’m having trouble seeing the Church’s role in helping those in need. It is a fact; however I have to fight to remember this. Talk about a spiritual battle.

  262. You asked about my dealings with churches.

    I was raised as a Roman Catholic. Though I did take First Communion and learned the basics, I never took Confirmation. My parents stopped going to St. Joseph when I was about 11 or 12 years old.

    Since I was a small child, I’d also read a KJV Bible. I told a nun and she encouraged me to keep reading. Just don’t be discouraged when reading Revelation. It is quite hard.

    My parents were raised Catholic but wanted nothing to do with High Mass and the rituals that Roman Catholic Church is known for.

    It wasn’t until the late 80s that I got introduced to “conservative Christians”. I attended a small Bible study and we were talking about the 7 letters in Revelation. Upon listening, I decided not to tell them I was a Catholic Christian. I only said I was a Christian. I had another conversation with someone from that group and was not thinking charitably of them.

    Yet, I was still seeking God. He kept after me. One evening, I knelt by my dorm room bed and ask God to save me and I didn’t want to go to Hell. I asked for forgiveness for my sins. Please tell me and I’ll confess.

    I don’t know what lead to it. I do know that I didn’t tell that group of what happened.

    It wasn’t until I left for Phoenix, AZ and put NJ behind me that I ran into the RCC v. Protestants stuff. Though I was turned off, I really didn’t want to go back to the Catholic Church. For quite awhile I attended some black Pentecostal churches and a nice National Baptist church. I never could settle down.

    My friend and former sister-in-law, a devout Catholic, suggested I’d look into a non denominational church. I’m glad I listen. God eventually opened a door that lead to Shore Vineyard in NJ. It is a moderate Charismatic church. It is small but has the potential of growing. Heck, it is growing!

  263. My problem with conservatives is that, they believe and think conservativism is PERFECT. Conservatives are pure, holy, without sin etc. Everyone is a sinner and immoral except them. Read divine’s posts and you’ll notice what i’m talking about.

  264. Barry,

    If your’e in a Vineyard church, your’e probably in a really good place. They emphasize compassion towards the poor, the Father heart of God and learning how to rest in Him. They lean heavily on the grace empowered christian walk. They also understand “New Covenent” christianity as I was speaking of before. That’s God changing us from the inside out instead of the old covenant were the law was set into place to change us from the outside in, which was really only to show us how much we cannot change ourselves and that we needed a savior. Unfortunately, many christians today try to live the christian walk under the old covenent model which has no power and also usually end’s in burnout.

    Just a side thought about the disabled and our current political landscape. Sarah Palin has pledged that special needs and disabled people would be a major focus for her agenda as vice-president. I don’t know how sincere she is, but the fact she does have a downs syndrome child tells me she probably takes this issue to heart.

  265. I am seeing what you’re talking about, in relationship to being in Shore Vineyard. 🙂 It just never crystalized into actual words, til you wrote it. 🙂

    If Sarah’s pledge came from someone else, I’d have taken it as rhetoric. However, I do believe she is sincere and will likely try to do so. I’m also sure that others may well be inspired to work with her on this task. BTW, I think she has a nephew or niece with down syndrome.

  266. Barry,

    As you were talking about the private sector earlier I had a thought. An interesting and fun idea came to me today that explains conservatism vs. liberalism on a down to earth level that I think everyone can understand. Let’s say it’s like a game of basketball or some other game. You’ve got:

    1. Players on the field – (Private Sector)
    2. Referees – (Government)

    Without the private sector, you have no players, therefore you have no game. Without referees you have no rules to play the game fairly. So, how does conservatism view the game and how it should be played?

    1. The referees must keep the game fair. They should penalize the players that foul and those that try to hurt the other players. This even means taking some out of the game if necessary. Hello Enron.

    2. The referees must not become “players on the field.” Referees must remain referees. This is a major difference between conservatism and liberalism. When the refs become players, this makes the game unfair because they are not only allowed to play the game but they are also allowed to make the rules. Also, they would have an interest in winning the game and not just refereeing it., so, say hello to corruption. Examples: The creation of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. Hybrid government subsides. Government bailouts. Bank and mortgage company takeovers. Everyone’s “too big to fail.”

    4. The players must not influence the referees to fix the game. Hello corrupt unions, hello corrupt wall street execs and corrupt lobbyists.

    5. The ref’s must leave the scoreboard alone. If the score is 98, 102 then the score is 98, 102. Another big difference between conservatism and liberalism. Liberalism says it’s not fair that there is a team that scores more, so they must “spread the wealth around” to make it fair. They would say, lets take 2 points from one team and give it to the other so that there are no losers. This is the cornerstone of socialism and communism. It sounds noble to have no “losers” but at what cost? In the end, all the players and the game itself suffers. Who wants to play the game if after all your hard work, practice, and training you come this far and have the ref’s take points away that you have earned. This makes many players in the game leave and find somewhere else to play overseas. Sound familiar? Just like in socialist countries, this kills the morale of workers, kills competition, kills the quality of goods and services produced. In the end, this is what has killed many a socialist, nationalist system or program. I was kind of for the “fair tax” that Huckabee put forth, where we all pay the same percentage of tax no matter how much someone makes.

    6. More teams in the league produce better players. Competition is what make us train and work harder. Take all of the challenge out of the game and we become lazy and produce a crapy team. Hello Microsoft and Bill Gates. Thank you God for Apple and Steve Jobs.

    The bottomline, conservatism and liberalism is not about compassion or lack thereof. These are simply the rules in which the game is played. Furthmore, the private sector and the government both have their roles to play in this game. Evil and corrupt people can be in both government and private sector, but we cannot throw away the whole game because of a few bad apples. That is liberalism, socialism and the easy way out. The answer here is that everyone must find their correct roles in the game again and start playing by the rules.

  267. Great analogy, Jacob.

    It shows perfectly the need for balance. It is true that we don’t need the referees doubling as players and referees. I wrestled in high school and can identify.

    Some rule modifications needed to be made, so I could compete fairly. It was a matter of the match was started and that is it. However, it would not have been good if the referee did the work for me.

    How much rule making should there be? I can easily see three groups of competing thoughts:
    1. The “Far Left” would say “Let’s inundate the sport, whether it be basketball or wrestling with a ton of rules. Let’s regulate every aspect of the game, so that all can compete. This include those who really shouldn’t be playing basketball or shouldn’t be wrestling.”
    2. The “Far Right” would say “Let’s do away with regulations! Let’s those who can compete, compete.”
    3. The “Moderate” would say “Let’s put forth regulations so that the players can compete, with fairness. Let’s apply a correct amount of rule modification in specific cases. Let’s not overburden players with rules or say “no rules”; let the players become discouraged and not want to enjoy the sport.”

    Hehe, I really do fall in the third category.

  268. Jacob,

    This conversation is reminding me of a curious scene that God showed me.

    One morning, after praying about some prophetic words, a strange scene appeared before me. I was at the studio where Sean Hannity & Alan Colmes do their show. Yes, I do occasionally do watch their show.

    In the vision, I notice something rather odd. Alan was sitting in Sean’s seat and Sean was sitting in Alan’s chair. Alan looked at me and said “We’re not the one who’s confused here.” He said it in a warm friendly voice with a touch of humor. Sean didn’t say anything.

    That was it.

  269. Read the following latest word from Chuck Pierce. This really confirms what my heart has been feeling about the spiritual and political landscape today in America.

    Guys, I’ve got to be honest with all of you. Like bellybuttons, everyone’s got an opinion, so here goes mine. I’ve really been thinking a lot about Obama lately and this word from Chuck Pierce really confirms it. There have been several things that have concerned me about this election America seems to have lost it’s trust in our democracy and is looking for a king, not a president. I have been careful not to jump to conclusions but after this election season, I am convinced Barrack Obama is a King Saul…at least to the many that are voting for him. Recently, I had a friend who was asked why they were voting for Obama. They replied, “Because he gives me hope.” I thought this person was joking, but it turned out to be for real. No politician, McCain or Obama gives me hope. Only Jesus gives me hope. Most politicians just give me heartburn.

    I’ve been very disturbed by the reaction of supporters when Obama comes into town and his “presence is made manifest.” People fainting and crying. Kids chanting songs about Obama and how he’s going to change the world. Video’s made with literal worship songs playing in the background such as the Vineyard worship song “Sanctuary” with words saying, “Manifest Obama, America.” Videos with leaders such as Farraken calling him Messiah. Something is really wrong here. I would be as equally disturbed if this was McCain or McAnybody. What’s happening to us?

    The nation of Israel wanted to be like the other nations because they had kings but Israel did not. At that time Israel only had a system of Judges to rule the land. God said He wanted to be there only king but this wasn’t enough for Israel. We are at the same crossroads. In fairness, this isn’t to say that Obama wants to be a king but many are projecting this onto him. People are literally saying he will take care of them so they won’t have to worry about paying there mortgage or gas anymore or that he’s going to be the bringer of peace to the world. There is no prince of peace except for THE Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus. They are the servants of “We The People.” They work for us. We have the ability to hire and fire them through votes. Please pray that we will trust in Jesus as King and no one else. Not in any political party or president. We are still one nation under God. We need no King but you Lord Jesus!

  270. “As surely as Bill Clinton will become President of the United States of America….” I was understandably shocked and awed by the Divine message but very encouraged. I knew then that the outcome of the US election would be an indisputable assurance that God’s promise to me would come to pass even when the odds were against me.

    At the time, I remember sharing the prophetic word to some close Christian friends who were made keenly aware of what was going to happen in America. The Church I attended, however, was very deeply opposed to Bill Clinton becoming President and had fervent intercessory prayer against him but to no avail. Like many die-hard conservative Christians who oppose the Democrats they would not even remotely consider the possibility that God may have a very different perspective on an individual with their flaws, on the one hand, and His Divine capacity to use them for His
    long term purposes despite themselves and their political parties’ manifestos.

  271. jacob, we get it..Obama is evil and McCain is righteous and holy. Obama is running to be president not to be king. NO ONE is saying that if Obama is elected, they won’t pay their mortgages or gas. Those are ideas proposed by John McCain, that is suspending the gas tax and spending 300 billion to buy houses with bad mortgages. If you don’t like Obama’s policies, then come out and say it and stop hiding behind morality and God as the only reason you oppose Barack.

  272. A very interesting thing happened to me about 8 years ago. I attended a 4th of July celebration event held at a big stadium in Shreveport, LA with thousands of people. Delirious? lead worship at the event and you wouldn’t believe what Martin Smith said in the middle of leading worship. Now remember, Delirious? is from England and they are leading worship at our July 4th, independence from Great Britain celebration! Get it? As the patriotic streamers and balloons were falling Martin says, “We don’t need this patriotism crap…what we need is revivalism.” Wowzers! You talk about offensive, but you know what he was right.

    We can not worship the god of patriotism, America, McCain or Obama. Our nation is in a very sensitive right now. We want anything to save us and we just may fall for anything. The idol worship I’ve been seeing of Obama concerns me and for those who want conservatism over God, I believe we can fall for the same idol worship of a conservative candidate as well. I Consider myself very patriotic but patriotism must take a back seat to our Lord Jesus Christ…way back! Sure, I do not like Obama’s policies and in some ways McCains are even more frustrating because I don’t think he believes what he preaches about conservatism. All this aside what we need right now is REVIVALISM.

  273. Divine, Barry, Joe & anyone else,

    Ok folks. I know it’s not necessarily spiritual but it’s time to make a prediction on who will win. Then, we can all come back Wednesday, rub it the face of all who got it wrong or cry in shame and admit defeat for the those who did get it wrong. Yeah, picking the next president is important and it may decide if this is the final flush down the crapper for our nation but hey, let’s make it fun in the process.

    I’ll go first. I predict John McCain will win. I know there’s no bonus points for this but I also predict it will be a late night and that it will come down to Ohio. Anyone else?

  274. I predict an Obama landslide.

  275. Prophecy from Hank Kunneman

    This prophecy was given in 2007 and no one can honestly read through this whole page with an open honest heart and still claim these prophecies are refering to McCAIN.


  276. If we as Christians don’t get out the vote for McCain, then God will give us what we deserve not what we want (as He did with the Jewish people in the Old Testament when He gave them a King that they begged for.) All He wanted to be was their King. Perhaps what happens on Nov. 4th will force us to get on our knees and look up to Jesus for our salvation. God did say that if those that are called by His name turn from their wicked ways and acknowledge Him once again, then He will hear their prayers and deliver them.

  277. The Jeremiah Wright controversey will not work this time. McCain has stooped very low this time.

  278. Let’s don’t get racial as I know some of you Christians are

  279. A little wake up call to all my peeps that’s been down with me since day one. No matter who we vote for, we have now become the USSA (United Socialist States of America). All thanks to Captain Bailout (George W. Bush) and both parties of congress, we’re going to take our first real swing at socialism. You’ve got Obama who is a pure socialist and McCain who wishes he was, if it wasn’t for us doggone conservatives getting in his way. I guess we’ll never learn from history…or is it we don’t even teach history anymore. Anyone remember that “little” failure called the Soviet Union. Oh well, I guess George Washington and the boys had it all wrong. Karl Marx………COME ON DOWN! You’re our next contestant on The Price Of Our Freedom Is Right! Tell us what we’ve won Bob!

  280. Obama is not a socialist!!

    Btw, katie don’t worry, we christians will make sure Barack Obama gets elected.

  281. This is my first time on here. I read what everyone has written and am pleased to see such passionate discussion. God Bless all of you. We must pray for one and all. Let us pray that there will be peace on election day and peace after the winner is revealed. My opinion on who will win is the McCain/Palin ticket. This election will be remembered for centuries to come. There is one important prophecy location that comes to mind for me. On February 10, 2007 from Scottsdale, Arizona prior to McCain announcing his candidacy, Clement said that a hot blooded man would become President. At the time of this prophecy McCain resided from Scottsdale. This is a specific point that is a sign I believe. McCain has been a man that has been left for dead all of his political career only to continue to come back and win. Obama is exhibiting symptoms of Pride Before The Fall. It greatly upset me when many of his followers and black leaders such as Louis Farrakhan said that Obama was the Messiah and Obama did nothing to correct.

  282. This is the second time in my 40 years as a voting citizen to vote the democratic ticket. Carter was my first and he was a godly man and Barack Obama is my second and I pray he lives long enough to be a blessing to those who care so much about him. Now you Christians, clean up your act. I have been disgraced, appaulled and embarrassed by what I have read and heard from my fellow Christians over this man. Not just here but on other reviews. Your stance, (prolife) which I still agree with only to the limit that once I have researched McCain, and Palin thoroughly and after two years struggling with the vote I did finally cast it for who I and the majority feel is the better man for the job. Now You probably will insult me and tell me I will go to hell. But now that I have been on the other side for two months I again will say I am embarrassed for the Christian right and their rudeness, aggression, ignorance, and bigotry. Now you will get to pray for the leader you can’t stand. And while you are at it why don’t you listen to what he says.

  283. Okey Dokey Joe the brick layer. Not that it matters or that you will change your mind, but I’m just curious. Do you know what the definition of socialism is? Do you know it’s history? Do you know it’s history in our own nation? Do you know what the “progressive movement” is, how it started and who it’s influences are? Do you know who Karl Marx or Friedrich Engels is and what Marxism is? Do you know what “Black Liberation Theology” is? Do you know the difference between socialism and communism? Do you know who the “fabian socialists” are. Do you understand what “classical liberalism” is and how it’s meaning has changed. Since it’s hardly taught in our public schools anymore, maybe you could do a little homework that will take you beyond the goofy one-liners you always post. Ra Ra for Obama! Ra Ra for McCain! It’s all crap. You might as well be rooting for your favorite sports team. Your comments have about that much depth.

    If you so choose to stop building brick walls and do some homework, maybe there could be real dialog. Then you could put socialism up against Obama’s AND McCain’s past records and have a real working knowledge of these issues. Until then, I guess It’s just “GOOOOOO TEAM!” Right Joe?

  284. Judy,

    NEWS FLASH! You’re not going to go to Hell because you voted for Obama or McCain. If anything, it will the motive of your heart that will determine anything. It is possible to have good motives in voting for Barack Obama.


    I’ve never heard of Fabian socialism and may look it up. I will definitely reexamine “classical liberalism”.

    As for me, I will vote McCain. I really don’t like the demonstrated pride coming from Obama. Yes, we do have responsibilities to the global community; however this is supposed to be secondary to the needs of the US. Obama is supposed to be running for Prs of the US and not the World.



    My name is Keneth D. Butler Jr.
    Email me at



  286. I take it that Ken is viewing Barack Obama as an agent of judgment on this country.

    As a nation, it is true that we have sinned against God, Almighty. Do we foolishly think that God won’t deal with such wickedness? Of course, God will assuredly deal with them.

    The question is “How”?

    I am recalling a story from Jeremiah. God told him to wear a wooden collar and go to the Temple. He was to proclaim God’s judgment on Judah. While there, a man came to him and broke off the collar and gave a false word. The people believed the false prophet over Jeremiah.

    Jeremiah simply left and sought God. The wooden collar was to be changed into an iron collar. Instead of an easy 70 years of captivity; it would now be very rogh.

    How does this relate to the two candidates? I honestly believe that God will deal with this country’s sins; however, the question is this. Do we choose the wooden collar or the iron collar?

    I do not speak of exiles or captivity. Rather, in what way shall God deal with us? Which candidates is the wooden and which is the iron? I can’t tell but I’d advise not leaping to conclusion.

  287. Barry,

    I’ll leap for you. Obama is the iron collar. McCain is the wooden. Both are troublesome, however, Palin “could” be the window of mercy in this senario. The shaping of history still belongs to the intercessor. As Obama loves to say, “We are the ones we’ve been waiting for.” How arogant, how New Agish! Humanism is now our god. Intercessors, stand up and stand in the gap. It is God we must be “waiting for”. Only in Him will America renew her strength. As for McCain, though he thinks he is using us christians with the selection of Palin to get elected, we must pray God will suprise him on who is really using who. Christ Jesus sits on the throne he’s setting the stage but we do have a part to play as kingdom people.

  288. Barry and jacob, has it ever occured to you that God can use Barack Obama in a good way? From what i’ve been reading here, you would think God is not powerful or wise enough to you Barack Obama for his own good purposes. Remeber that his ways are not ways and his thoughs are way higher than our thoughts. That is the problem i have with the christian right.

  289. Btw, i have been looking at the actions of the revered Palin you guys adore so much, and some of her actions have been very unchristianlike. She is just like any other politician out there. It was very telling when she said in a church that the iraq war was a task from God but when she was confronted by Charlie Gibson, she denied it and lied about it.

  290. Your sarcasm is correct about Palin. She’s not a revered and not perfect, but Ahhhh Joe, I’m so glad you brought up the Iraq thing concerning Palin. Most, including much of the mainstream media admitted that Gibson took her words out of context and even misquoted her. Don’t take my word for it, do your own research on that. Here’s excerpt of that interview:

    GIBSON: You said recently, in your old church, “Our national leaders are sending U.S. soldiers on a task that is from God.” Are we fighting a holy war?

    PALIN: You know, I don’t know if that was my exact quote.

    GIBSON: Exact words.

    Sorry Charlie. This was a misquote. Why did Charlie only quote part of the sentence she spoke, much less the whole paragraph? Oh, thats right. He’s got an agenda. Here’s her quote in its entirety:

    “Pray for our military men and women who are striving to do what is right. Also, for this country, that our leaders, our national leaders, are sending [U.S. soldiers] out on a task that is from God,” she exhorted the congregants. “That’s what we have to make sure that we’re praying for, that there is a plan and that that plan is God’s plan.”

    The first part of the paragraph or the first part of the sentence for that matter was left out. Kinda sheds a little more light on it doesn’t it. And then she ends her quote that should leave us with no question with what she is saying.

    “That’s what we have to make sure that we’re praying for, that there is a plan and that that plan is God’s plan.”

    She is saying we must pray that there is a plan, and that it should be God’s plan that is done.

  291. Pray for our military men and women who are striving to do what is right. Also, for this country, that our leaders, our national leaders, are sending [U.S. soldiers] out on a task that is from God,” she exhorted the congregants. “That’s what we have to make sure that we’re praying for, that there is a plan and that that plan is God’s plan.”

    Spin it anyway you want to Jacob, but she said clearly that our national leaders are sending our soldiers on a task that is from God. If she didn’t think the iraq war wasn’t a plan from God, she wouldn’t have made that statement in the first place.

  292. Is anyone watching Kim Clement live tonight? He’s discussing the election and was God has been showing him. You can access it on his website. The times are 6:00pm PST, 7:00pm MST and 9:00pm EST.

  293. the webcast Is not working for me

  294. Okay i caught a lil bit of the ending, and from what i saw it was very vague.

  295. I just cast my vote for OBAMA

  296. I just cast my vote for McCain/Palin.

  297. Whoever missed the live webcast with Kim Clement last night can now see it this morning as it is now available. Last night many had technical difficulties and were unable to see it so here it is…

  298. ANy more doubts, Joe? See the webcast that Clement did last night on his website. McCain baby!

  299. I just cast my vote for Palin.

  300. I just cast my vote for Ronald Reagan. In my dreams I guess. Oh well, guess I’ll go for McBama.

  301. Divine, lol i watched some of it and he was VERY vague. I think he’s trying to have it both ways, so that when either of them wins, he can claim he prophecied it.

  302. No Joe. It’s very clear he’s prophecying that McBama will win. Open your eyes Joe.

  303. Now what do people say about this person who also claimed he heard from God!

  304. Hi America,

    God gave me this verses last night when I pray:

    2 Kings 6:16-18:
    16 So he answered, “Do not fear, for those who are with us are more than those who are with them.” 17 And Elisha prayed, and said, “LORD, I pray, open his eyes that he may see.” Then the LORD opened the eyes of the young man, and he saw. And behold, the mountain was full of horses and chariots of fire all around Elisha. 18 So when the Syrians came down to him, Elisha prayed to the LORD, and said, “Strike this people, I pray, with blindness.” And He struck them with blindness according to the word of Elisha.

    Our Jesus Christ listen and answer His children pray. God of Heaven and earth will show His power in America.

    On last Tuesday, God want me to share this to all christian in America: 2 Chronicles 7:14:
    14 if My people who are called by My name will humble themselves, and pray and seek My face, and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin and heal their land.

    He said: ” When my people humble themselves and turn back to them. When my people turn from their wicked way, I will heal their country.” He said that over and over and over to me.

    All Christian, seek His face, humble ourselves, turn from our wicked ways, repent again and again, as mercy to our Jesus Christ for our beloved country, America.

    Only His children that can make changes in here.
    I hope everybody will be bless with this verses. God bless you all…..

  305. McBama landslide baby! You’ll see. You’ll all seeeeee!

  306. who is McBama?

  307. Doesn’t look good for McCain right now.

  308. Divine,,what happened to the prophecies about McCain winning? Is kim going to put away his piano now? Shame on you christians who were so blinded by partisan bias. Shame on you divine who ridiculed Prophet steve from billionsoulsforchrist for being “a no name”. Seems the no name prophet got it right and the big show prophets had it wrong.


    It’s a NEW DAY and JESUS IS LORD

  310. Joe,

    I guess you were right. My only real burden for this election was for the ending of the slaughter of the unborn and to stop the removal of God from our government that was established by our founding fathers. It’s not about a black man or a democrat. I’m happy for our nation that we have our first black president, and who cares if he is a democrat. There’s just some of us who have cried out to God in intercession for years or decades since the massive rebellion against God began in the 1960’s in our nation. I know most in the early church did not have the luxury of a pro-christian government but in essence as th scripture says, we are called to a light unto all the nations and to fullfill the great commission. On top of this we are commanded to pray His kingdom come on earth as it is in heaven. Our praying means we have a part to play. I don’t see issues like allowing the unborn to be murdered as his kingdom coming and His will being done on earth as it is in heaven. Who knows, God may use Obama to deal with these issues, though his record has been the extreme opposite. At any rate, congratulations, I know you are exited. As for me, I receive Obama as my president and I pray Gods blessings on him. I also pray Obama will walk in the destiny that God has for him and that he will be strengthened by the Holy Spirit to accomplish all that God has planned for him.


  311. Crickets…..LOL.

  312. I’m agree with you Jacob. I was talking with my friend regarding of this. God has reason in everything. The Bible said that we have to support our government no matter what happen. It’s not because John McCain lost and I say this, I said this because our Bible said to support our president. Support means we have to keep on praying for our government, specially for our new president. We don’t have to agree for what ever they say, but we honor that and we still praying for them and not curse them. Everything is in Our Father in Heaven’s plan, He already plan in beforeeeeeeee we even know about this.
    I just pray and I suggest all christian will pray with me to for our new president Barack Obama, that our Jesus Christ will work in him, that Holy Spirit will fill him. Again, there is nothing impossible when all God’s children pray together with one heart.

    I got confirmation about those verses that I got from our Lord Jesus last night. Check this website out:
    We as Christian, we don’t have to worry about anything, because our Jesus Christ always be with us, He will not let His children go down, He will always keep us. Stay close with our Lord Jesus. Never stop to seek His face, never stop. Keep on fire in Holy Spirit, don’t give up. Even more fire to serve our Lord Jesus, more fire in Holy Spirit.

    For Joe, God loves you so much, He wants you to know that and remember that. He died for you and me on the cross for our sins. We are the one who suppose to be die on the cross, because of our sins. But because Father in Heaven loves us so much, He gave he one and only one begotten Son to us to died on Calvary for our sins. And Jesus Christ loves us so much so He willing to died for us. If He think about the suffer and pain that He is going to go through, He will not doing it for us. But because He loves us SO MUCH, he willing to died. (John 3:16). Remember one thing, He never look how good we are, but He looks our heart. If we willing to open our heart, then He will come to us and change us 180 degree from our sins and our old ways.

    AGAIN FOR ALL CHRISTIAN, KEEP ON FIRE TO SERVE OUR JESUS CHRIST. Let Holy Spirit burnnnnnnn us more and more. Pray without ceasing, pray like you never pray before. GETTING CLOSER AND CLOSER TO OUR JESUS CHRIST.

    Love you always and God bless you.

    Also, let this blog be blessing to others. Let your light shine in us. In Jesus Christ name, Amen.

  313. Barry, on October 14th, 2008 at 9:52 am Said:
    I have been following Kim’s prophecies concerning the 2008 election, as well as attempting to find others. Thanks for delineating the prophecies. I have some observations and concerns.

    1.” The next POTUS will be hot blooded.”
    2. A former War Hero.

    I certainly agree that these point to McCain and not Obama. Barrack Obama certainly does not have a temper or a reputation of having one. As for military service, this would definitely point to Sen. McCain

  314. Tina, on July 4th, 2008 at 9:48 am Said:
    From Nigeria, early this year I asked God during my prayer session who He has chosen as POTUS. He mentioned OBAMA; He confirmed Obama would have many obstacles but He God would see him through all of them. He asked me to WATCH and see how He would take Obama there. I received a knowing that God is now ready to fulfil MLK’s dream using Obama. He added that He would put Obama’s name even in the mouths of babes; CNN confirmed this in one of their special reports where toddlers were calling O-B-A-M-A effortlessly but unable to mention Clinton Hillary. I have since then pursued God’s rhema word concerning Obama and my faith is made stronger daily as the Holy Spirit keeps telling me to WATCH and see how God will berth His word. God has made His choice and no negative comments about Obama will change the plan and purpose of God, for He saw those negative sides b4 He chose him, even b4 Obama was born God knew him. Fear God. He chooses who to use; nobody can dictate to Him. His foolishness is better than the wisdom of men. It is wisdom to be on God’s side! Shalom

  315. Hi Joe, I agree, with you that nobody can dictate our Jesus Christ. We are just human and His children and His servant, but everything is according to His will not ours.
    I can’t say that I don’t believe in prophecy, I do. But it’s better if for all prophecy that God give to us, we ask God to give us more confirmation. His voice is loud and clear, all His children that close to Him will know His voice, like sheep that know their shepherd’s voice.
    Remember we have to ask wisdom from the Lord before we say something and do something. Man’s wisdom is coming from this world, is coming from satan (James 3:15). CHRISTIAN, ASK WISDOM FROM FATHER IN HEAVEN. God bless you all 🙂

  316. I admit this may seem quite distasteful but I am quoting what I said before only because I still hve the same belief. We MUST be in prayer because there is a TREMENDOUS need for healing to take place in this country. It is God’s will to accomplish great things througn and within this Nation over the next 2 decades (and not just during the next Presidential term) God Bless.

    T, on September 8th, 2008 at 10:32 am Said:

    It is presumptive to assume that the statement ” gatekeeper that watched over New York who will once again stand and watch over this Nation” means President of the United Sates of America. Gatekeeper could also be a strong reference to “Secretary of Homeland Security” And that position could be offered to Guiliani from either McCain or Obama. Children could refer to Obama or Palin. “Hot Blood” seems to refer to McCain but who is to say that by the time this campaign season is over it won’t refer to Obama/Biden. Let’s simply pray that whoever these prophecies refer to that the next President will indeed be a person who prays for this nation the way these prophecies seems to indicate he will. God bless

    T, on September 26th, 2008 at 11:22 am Said:

    I would personally love to see Obama in office, but honestly I have to admit that aside from what I feel in my spirit, there are quite a few REPUTABLE prophetic voices that point towards McCain. At the end of the day, May God be glorified no matter who becomes President. And either way there will be a great need for healing after this election because this election will get much uglier and nastier before it’s over. No matter who wins the election, there will be a great need for the Church, the Body of Christ to be in great prayer and fasting for this nation.

  317. I just think all these prophets should just stay out of these elections. They have greatly damaged their credibilities. Let’s see if they admit their errors or if they try to spin it.

  318. Divine, on October 27th, 2008 at 6:06 pm Said:
    Wow, Joe, is showing more and more how mentally handicap he is!!!

    Not one of those prophecies he used pointed to WHO the next President is. “YOU” just filled in the blanks, (which contradict the prophecy by the way) to say what YOU are saying it is saying.

    No, OVM.ORG very CLEARLY says:



  319. All hail Joe! Anyhoot, way to go Joe. You were right and we’ve got egg sandwiches. I know your on cloud nine today. America has spoken. And from the looks of your posts…you keep speaking too. I guess we’ve got another new name for you. It’s “I Told You So Joe!” Goooo Joe! A real American hero.

  320. Kim Clement was dead wrong and must fess up. People need to get real for once and get a clue. No time to make excuses or to twist things around to make them fit your wishes. Kim Clement was talking some BS. Simple as that.

    Also, no, God did NOT put Obama in the WHiteHouse. The wicked people did.

    If you can recall, the wicked people cried out: “Give us Barabas! Give us Barabas!” When Pilate asked them who they wanted Jesus or the criminal.

    The mob crowd then shouted about Christ Jesus: “Crucify Him! Crucify Him!”

    You have just witnessed a repeat in history today. The wicked mob crowd of America shouted out “We want Barabas! Give us Barabas!” Instead of the one for Jesus.

    They have shouted for the past 8 years about Bush (who represents Christ) “Crucify Him! Crucify Him!”

    It wasn’t God who put Obama in the WhiteHouse…the wicked people did.

  321. Divine,

    Bush represents Christ? Ehhhhhhhhhhh. That’s overstepping it………..a lot and is about as wierd as all the messiah stuff we’ve been hearing about Obama.

  322. Unfortuntely Joe a true prophet’s ministry will always have some influence and involvement in the political arena. We only need to look at the prophetic ministries of Joseph, Daniel, Elijah, Elisha, Isaiah, etc. In fact, it would be impossible to find a biblical example of a prophet whose prophetic ministry did not reach into the political arena. Now as for Kim Clement, wouldn’t it be interesting if he has a photo that he will be able to show from his meeting with the now President-Elect that proves he prophesied this result over 5 years ago? Hmmm yes that WOULD indeed be interesting. And wouldn’t it be even more interesting if has a prophesied a VERY significant event that will take place in the year 2010? My question is only wouldn’t that be REALLY interesting? Because at that point who would it actually be that actually had egg on their face for misinterpreting a prophetic utterance. Divine if you submit yourself to prayer this week in a way you have not done in years, God will show you that he is NOT absent from this Obama/Biden move into the White House. Many of your brothers and sisters who you have incorrectly labeled “wicked” have also prayed for this change that has taken place. YES President George W. Bush will have some vindication in History. And YES it will become VERY apparent that there is “an element of righteousness” in Obama. God Loves you Divine VERY much, AND he loves President-Elect Barack H. Obama. He will hear his prayers in the White House just as he has heard his prayers from his Senate office.

    For those who will chose to beleive God has no part in this decision, that will unfortunately be your very experience until you can know that God is INDEED Omnipotent. Yesterday was a very public manifestation of a very public prophecy from Washington that significantly preceded Kim Clement’s arrival in ministry.

    Peter was offended by the Holy Spirit’s charge to minister to Cornelius (Acts 10), but he was obedient because although he PERSONALLY did not agree with it……he had to submit himself to what GOD wanted and not what he selfishly thought was right.

  323. I was up, early this morning. I’ve already suspected that it was Barack Obama who won.

    With some of the prophetic words I’ve heard, I sought God in prayer. I know that God is in control and am not worried. What came of my prayers?

    I recalled a sense that Barack Obama would become Pres. Obama back in February. I was actually seeking God’s directions for praying for some of the candidates and who would be the next POTUS. Obama’s name kept coming to mind. Once some information came to light, I began praying for his soul. I’d pray for him, off and on.

    Today, I recalled this and felt a need to continue praying. Let’s get real. The man may have come to faith in a Chicago church; however, I strongly suspect that he ingested a lot of poison while there. I feel that strongholds need to come down. I’ve felt that Obama needs to forgive certain people. It may well be what’s driving his extreme views on abortion.

    Yes, it would be good to pray that God would surround him with godly men and women to guide his administration. Yes, Barack does need to repent; however; he is going to need a lot of prayer. I am sure Divine can educate us on all the other stuff that needs repentance; however it doesn’t change the facts.

  324. As I sit here, it dawns on me that Barack Obama may well have “hot blood”.

    With McCain, his anger is generally explosive and would lead him to behave rashly.

    With Obama, he may well have an undercurrent of anger that isn’t apparent. This is stemming from the fact that he had an angry pastor for 20 years. If you’re exposed to such anger, you are likely to have some of it rub off on you.

    This is just my conjecture. Wouldn’t we’ve known this? Not really. If McCain’s antics weren’t documented, would we have called him, “hot blooded”?

  325. Barry,

    There’s something I have felt for a long time concerning the modern day prophetic movement for a while now, which I am a part of. It’s seems most prophetic words are all sunshine and good times. I’m not saying that God is an angry father wanting to beat His kids, but at the same time we hardly ever hear of consequences that may result in our turning from His ways. This really isn’t hard. Look at the luke-warmness and worldliness in our churches. The word “repentence” is almost a taboo in the modern charismatic movement today. It just reflects how the rest of the nation is doing. Not much difference between us and them.

    Does it really take that much discernment to see how we got here and where we are going? I’m always cautious of grand prophetic words of revival and spiritual revolution without even the mention of repentance. Our own greed and selfishness has gotten us here and now we are getting what we’ve asked for. We want the government to make all our problems go away. A slick package with a label called change, which we should simply translate “socialism.” Now we want to move back into mommy’s house (the government) so we don’t have to face the consequences of our actions. Wow, “consequences”, now there’s a word we don’t here much from many of the prophets in our day. Looks like it’s house cleaning time and it needs to start with us first, the church.

  326. Jacob

    There is nothing wrong with CHANGE
    and it is NOT SOCIALISM

  327. Well what needs to starts with us is repentence of sin and especially the hidden and imbeded RACISM. Come on you all know that it is there. Now it’s been brought to the front.

    The church will have to DEAL with it. How do you deal with it. GET RID OF IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! REPENT and MOVE ON. GET REAL AND GROW UP CHRISTIANS.

  328. I see that I’m not the only one who is concerned about the consequences of racism; especially in the Church.

    There are reasons so many godly African Americans voted in drove for Obama. I can appreciate the historic moment, but I thought it odd to see so many Christians in the black churches voting for Obama. This is in comparison to the near 50/50 for Christians in white churches.

    Obama is quite right when saying that racism in this country is not the same as it was 50 years ago. There is a reason that so many African Americans are loyal to the Dems.

    It isn’t a matter of exposing the truth. It is about a turning from sins committed by both parties. You may want to read Lou Engles’ Blog. It wasn’t just on abortion! Lou also spoke about the silence of the white conservative church.

    It is with irony that Barack Obama is being credited with potentially healing America of her racial wounds. Truth is, Obama can’t do it alone. The Church has to rise up and participate and it begins with confession and repentance.

    It is nice to say, “Lord, please heal the wounds of the African American community.” However it also requires action on our part.

  329. Well said jamie. We don’t know Obama’s personal relationship with God so please let’s stop all the judging and pray for Him that God will use him mightily.

    As for you divine, stop calling fellow believers who voted for Barack as wicked people. That’s the problem with you but i thank God that narrow minded, hateful christans like you didn’t prevail in this election.

  330. Divine,
    you are not scriptual. You have a message of horrible hate. You need to stop.and maybe have a demon of hate and ignorance CAST OUT

    People that voted for Obama are NOT wicked. YOU ARE

  331. Jamie,

    I really feel your anger and I’m sorry. I don’t know if you are directing it towards my comments or some other hurt that you may have experienced. Not that it matters, but I am a white person with African American parents. Just to set the record straight, It is not Obama that has lead us to socialism. Actually, it has been the Bush administration that has done the most to push us towards socialism.

    I really suggest you do a study on what socialism is and it’s relation to the “progressive movement” that started in the late 19th century. It had a big push during president FDR with the “New Deal” then with president Johnson with “The Great Society.” Now with the bailouts as of late, we have leaped into socializing our banking system and nationalizing the mortgage companies. It seems that everything is too big to fail right now and when the government bails it out, they must also take it over. This is socialism. McCain was one of the guys who voted for all these bailouts. He has shown no spine. Either way we were going to get socialism, at least with McCain though, his own party could have kept him in a little more check. However, with Obama, there is no speedbump to slow this down because the modern democrat party has shifted further left towards socialism. Aside from socialism, the real burdens that are on our heart as christians is the issues of murdering the unborn and the removal of God’s standards from our nation. This is no longer the democrat part of JFK. The blue dog democrats that your parents and grandparents voted for no longer run the party.

    Again, my heart really breaks concerning you anger. This is the cloud that follows many of us “values” voting white christians around. We want to prove we are not racist but then we are asked to set aside our core values such as being pro-life and so on. Actually, I am begging to see a strong conservative African American Christian stand up for us and the issues we believe in like protecting the unborn. Until then there’s always that doubt that people think we are racist. I’m sorry, I truly am. I wish you could see my heart beyond my words.

  332. Jamie,

    I do know about discrimination and have dealt with it since birth. I was born with low vision, severe hearing loss and a slight facial paralysis. I am well acquainted with society’s bigotry towards the disabled. I say this to show some measure of empathy.

    People with disabilities have experienced discrimination for thousands of years. While better than many other countries, America still has a long way to go. Yes, I am aware the history and yet I chose to forgive.

    I greatly appreciate the historic moment and am getting a glimmer of what it means for the black community and others to have Barack as president. No, I do not call all who’ve voted for Barack wicked.

    There were wicked people who voted for McCain, as well. Is everyone who voted for McCain, a racist? I think not. Is everyone who voted for Barack, godless? Again, I think not.

    Was God’s hand in this election? Did anyone notice that Barak won Virginia? He didn’t have to and yet he did. There is a symbolic reason for this. Care to do more then guess?

  333. I would hope we have come to a point in this nation where we can strongly disagree on issues without calling each other racist. I would really encourage Jamie or anyone not to play the race card. Once the race card is played, the debate is shut down. You trap someone in a box if no matter they say about someone’s policies you are still a racist. We must have debate in this nation! To play the race card is to misuse political correctness so you can shut down your opponent. In all the weeks I have been on this thread I have not heard any McCain supporter use racist comments. If I say I am not a Obama supporter am I a racist? If the answer is yes, then we are in real trouble in the days ahead, To shut down debate is the beginning of fascism. We are better than this guys. Congress is already wanting to reinstate the “fairness doctrine” to shut down much of talk radio and other conservative media venues. Trust me, we don’t to start shutting each other down. I may disagree with your point of view, but we need your point of view if it means keeping freedom intact in our nation. ‘Cause once they come for me, it won’t be long that when my party is in power they will start to come for you. We must protect freedom at any cost!

  334. It is typical blinded people who call anyone wicked and hateful when a loving person stands up against lies and evil. Hate is actually what Joe and the Obama crowd has spewed during this whole thread.

    Those of us who love love and love righteousness are loving, not hateful. God is not hateful, yet His wrath is unmatched. Get a clue please.

    Again, absolutely, those who voted for Obama were the wicked. Wicked means “crooked” or “confused”. That’s exactly the description for those who would vote for a man “just” because he is black. Or a person who would vote for a man who is “for” murdering innocent children, “for” defying marriage, “for” taking away competitive market and forcing businesses to hike up prices to make up for tax hikes, “for” manipulating young people into developing a dependency of government and eroding away any enterpreneurial spirits.

    Anyone who voted “against” a candidate who was “for” protecting innocent children, protecting marriage, protecting the entepreneurial spirit, and encouraging market competition…is plain out “crooked”.

    Simple really.

    Then, bias? Yeah, I’m “for” righteousness and “for” or “biased” for the love of God and His truth. yeah, I’d say so.

  335. Then, read it in the Gospels. The “MAD MOB” that Pontius Pilate asked, “Who should I set free?”

    They responded in very SIMILIAR fashion as the election day yesterday…”BARABAS! Give us Barabas!” (Who happened to be a CRIMINAL and an UNGODLY man)

    They turned to the innocent man who represented God and represented the love of God and truth and righteousness…Christ Jesus…and the “MAD MOB” cried out: “CRUCIFY HIM! CRUCIFY HIM!” Very EERILY similiar to what you see the irrational and HATEFUL rhetoric from Liberal Democrats shouting to a President who has opened doors back to religious freedoms and is responsible for many faith-based initiatives and appointing PRO LIFE JUSTICES to the Supreme Court….they have shouted out: “CRUCIFY HIM! CRUCIFY HIM!….GIVE US BARAK OBAMA (BARABAS)…. WOw! Eery it is so similiar!!!

    Whoever can’t see that…is BLIND.

  336. DIvine,

    You know we love ya bro but “Barabas” sounds like “Barak Obama” and that’s “eery” to you? Divinester, you need to come back to earth. Were you one of those Y2K guys stockin’ up on spam and peanut butter for the new millennium?

    On a side note. Remember Bobby Conner’s word to Lou Engle about the new president coming in a “brown bag” with five loaves and two fishes that would sustain us through hard times. Hmmm. I wonder if Obama is that “brown” bag. Maybe God will surprise Obama with His Holy Spirit and surprise us. Lord have mercy!

  337. LOL..divine. Your candidate lost and God will prevailed in this election. I posted several prophecies indicating Obama was the right guy for the job but most of you ignored it.


    United States
    The United States has been saved from those who would remove God from its borders, but now the nation must be established. There is a four-year window for the intercessors to war for the establishment of morality and righteousness. God is going to raise up a president in 2008 who will reconcile the nations to the United States. Bush has been called to be a man of war, like David, but God is bringing a Solomon to the office in ‘08 who will make peace with the nations.

  338. The no name prophet Steven Odonga. The nobody, said Divine.

    What happened Divine?

  339. Your guy LOST

  340. Be nice people..

  341. Divine,

    I hate to break this to you, but you’re the one who is hateful. Yes, Joe did strike me, as being dense at times. However, he wasn’t hateful.

    By the way, according to you, the skinheads and other white supremacists were righteous as they likely voted for McCain. Take care with your tone of accusations.

    No, I am not suggesting that all who voted for McCain are such as these. A good many are not!

    Consider this quote: “We have a right to debate in this country. With this or any other administration.” The speaker is quite right. She was speaking on the fact that the US has a rich history in debating. Care to guess who this was?


  342. Ack! I wanted to create a line between the last paragraph and the other part. Please skip the BTW.

  343. I went over to the Elijah List to see what’s what. There was an interesting message from Chuck Pierce. It really didn’t have to do with the Election. Rather, it dealt with the very topic that we’re talking about. Hearing the voice of the Lord, without hearing our own desires.

    Have fun rading:

  344. Barry, unfortunately this will happen every election cycle. The republican candidates will be prophecied by some of these prophets to be ordained by God to win. I will not be surprised if Kim Clement points to the prophecy given about Obama that he knew Obama was going to win. He may be right after all, because i never saw him personally claim the things Divine claimed he said. I think Divine put a lot of words in these prophets mouth without ever providing links to back them up. Btw, i watched a broadcast by cindy Jacobs concernin the elections and even though she was disapointed, she said Obama has said he was a believer and we shouldn’t be cynical to doubt or scoff at his salvation. After all, the heart of the king is in the hand of God. I truly believe Obama will not follow the so called radical agenda that the exreme right wing have been saying he would.

    Once again, we should be VERY careful not to let our personal preferences and bias cloud what the Lord is trying to do or speak through us.

    By Chuck Pierce


    I’ve never seen less clarity than during this season over who would be the next President. This, I believe, was a tactic of God. And I’ve always said God can change a man or a nation in a moment. I’ve also said God is NOT a Republican nor a Democrat. HE is in charge of the universe.

    Jesus had ample opportunity to criticize the government of HIS day. Yet HE chose to correct the People of God instead. Both parties have things they have done right and have also done wrong.

    Earlier this morning, our editor Julie Smith and I were praying and talking about the election outcome. She shared with me that last night after Barack Obama was announced the winner, God simply told her to “Pray for him like he is a son.” I believe this is the heart of God over our new President-elect – because he is a son and we are to pray for him as one.

    Please keep the current and the next President in your prayers. This is a both-and situation. I TRULY believe that for most prophetic voices, God HID who would be the next President. And add to the fact that we are the most righteous nation on the earth, giving generously and praying fervently in this last season. We are a people that need to stand and not allow the rift of this nation to get any wider than what it already is.

    I could go on, but this is simple and irrefutable. We often ask why a given prayer is not answered. Well, it is. God always answers the prayer of agreement. God knows our prayers even before we pray them. It says so in the Word. Nothing is without the will and purpose of God. Nothing!

    I leave you with this Scripture – this applies to every creature on earth and every man, woman and child:

    Psalm 139:16, “Your eyes saw my unformed body. All the days ordained for me were written in Your book before one of them came to be.”


    Steve Shultz

  346. The reason why most evangelical churches keep wanting a republican is because they are the only political party who are standing up for the rights of the unborn, holding back the homosexual agenda and trying to stop the stripping away of our biblical moral foundation that was established by our founding fathers. Those of us in the evangelical community do not see these as small “little” problems. We see these a serious abominations that threaten to bring down our nation just as in the Bible. If the democrat party would begin to stand up for these things, we would switch in a heartbeat and argue about taxes and liberalism latter.

    Someone please help me here. Everyone seems to want to ignore this. Are we filled with hate for wanting to protect the unborn? Are we racist for standing up for these principles? What will it take for those that call themselves christians to allow this to effect their heart. It effects God’s heart. Please someone help me here and tell me why murdering million of unborn babies is not wrong and barbaric. Was the holocaust of the Jews an abomination? Was slavery in our nation an abomination? Why are we not up in arms as christian over this, black and white?

    Now that I think about it, I think I know why. Slavery was visable for all to see. The slaughter of the Jews at the hand of Nazi Germany was for all to see. Abortion? It’s hidden within the womb. It’s hidden within the abortion clinic. There is no one to hear the cry of the babies. It’s out of sight, out of mind. Please…someone help me here to understand what I am missing. Show me the error of my ways. Joe? Jamie? Anyone at all?

  347. Joe,

    That is why it is essential to pray Pres. Obama in a spirit of love.

    He is going to be vulnerable to the whims of both the far left and the far right.

    I did a study on the definition of “classical liberalism” ad it lead to a look at both social liberalism and social conservatism. WOW!

    1. Classic liberalism sounds suspiciously like fiscal conservatism.
    2. Social conservatism could fall under the banner of “do gooders with a Judeo-Christian bent. It is this group that would sometimes be called “liberal”. Hello Mike Huckabee. 🙂
    3. Social liberal like to be associated with doing good; however, they see the government as the means. Many seems to be very humanistic.

    It is also worth noting that social conservatives are sometimes at odds with fiscal conservatives.

    Did my research via Wikipedia.

  348. Barry,

    When you did your research did you see the part where being called a socialist in the USA was very unpopular in the early 20th century so they attempted to attach themselves to the name of “liberalism.” They highjacked the name. They succeeded and took over the label “liberalism.” This is why it’s meaning had changed. It would have not worked when the original socialists infiltrated our nation in the late 1800’s by calling themselves “socialist.” They needed a new name to separate themselves from that unpopular term. Modern day liberalism IS “socialism” unlike “classical liberalism” which really is “libertarianism.” Also, it was a movement called the “progressive movement” that took up this mantle as the first modern day liberals. Woodrow Wilson was our first “progressive” president. Look at his presidency and what he did. It will scare the crap out of you. Everything from shutting down media outlets and throwing people in jail who voiced opposition to his government. There is much more to this history which I am sure you will find out as you continue to study. Social Liberalism, Progressivism, and Socialism are all brothers. They all may look a little different with various degrees of socialism but they all have the same philosophy of socialism.

    There is more I would like to share about this but there is not enough room here.

  349. If anyone is interested, here is your next homework assignment. These socialist philosophies actually has it’s root in Darwin’s theory of evolution. Study this and “eugenics”. You will find how evolution actually is a racist philosophy. Evolution says that some races are more “evolved” than other races. This fueled the study of eugenics in the early 1900’s and lead to the dire in trying to create the master race. This was the root of Nazi germany.

    Evolution, Socialism, Marxism, Eugenics, Nazism. We did some really scarey stuff back in the late 1800’s and early 1900’s. All these philosophies are related to one root…HUMANISM. The idea that we do not need God and that we will “evolve” to perfection without Him. It’s the tower of Babel all over again and we are still fighting it today. Some of the names have changed but it’s all the same game.

  350. I’m not surprised to find secular humanism at the center of social liberalism and other philosophies. I, already knew there was a racist element to evolution –>Battle of the Fittest ring any bells?

    Isn’t it interesting to see modern liberals masquerading as “social conservatives” and social conservatives not seeing themselves as the real agents of change. Yes, Christians are the real liberals or agents of change. No wonder we have problems with other types of conservatives.!

  351. This prophet may not be ‘somebody’ but he sure got my attention when he prophesied in 2001 that Ghana would soon discover oil and it came true. Like the no name Odonga they could be hearing from God.

    Also see my earlier posting

  352. Riddle me this. Should we vote for people based on prophecies or on Luke 6:44, “…every tree is known by its own fruit.”

    I say as a future lesson, when the prophets begin to speak, listen to what they have to say, take it to heart, BUT in the end we must vote for someone based on the fruit they have produced. That means reviewing their voting record, friends they hang around, and what they have said about the related issues. For instance, If someone has a clear pro-abortion, pro-infanticide record….I’m sorry “prophets”, but I’m voting by the fruit I see.

  353. I encourage everyone to read what Dutch Sheets has to say concerning the elections:


  354. I just have Tim. FINALLY SOMEONE IS SPEAKING THE TRUTH!!!! No more sunshine and good time prophets without repentance. Wake up church! Wake up America before it’s too late!

    Click Prophecies and then USA prophecy

    To anyone:
    let me know what you think. I find it very very interesting

  356. Dutch sheets is a sore and bitter loser who didn’t even call for prayers for our president elect. How shameful!!

    He has been proven wrong concerning this election before and i pray God proves him wrong concerning how God is going to use Barack for good not for evil. Shame on you dutch sheets.

  357. Fulfillment of the prophecy on 4 November 2008: The fulfillment of the prophetic dream against seemly incredible odds shows that The Almighty Living God had set the date for change. No amount of false prophecies even from among politicized Christians would change His mind. I have heard of false prophecies by some prominent politicized Christian leaders that the reign of President Obama would lead to the decline and destruction of the USA.

    The dream, however, reveals the true nature of the Obama Presidency. President Obama will be an inclusive President and will sit down and talk to the people at their level. I have never ever seen on Television a US President sit down in the Whitehouse before the Press with his senior staff administration officials and accept a grilling from the media. It seemed in the dream that Obama was comfortable meeting with the press in this forum. He was prepared to spend a long time answering questions and seeking to remain connected through the media to the people.

    Wow, Steve had it right from the beginning about what he saw concerning Obama. Who should we believe? Steve who had it right from the start or Sheets who had it wrong from the start. You decide!!

  358. Why did you vote for Obama Joe? “Cause he stands up for the little guy? That would be great. I sure wish he’d stand up for the little guys thrown in trash cans before they even had a chance to voice their choice. I wish he’d get down on their level. Oh that’s right, he sayed they are a punishment. That’s real righteousness Joe. You’ve chosen your side. God is not done with this yet. He will have his day to avenge to blood of the unborn, either in this life on in the hear after, though I do pray His mercy for people like you who have seem to have sold their soul to a spirit of death and have placed priority of the economy over real live human beings. Later Joe and everyone else on this thread. Be blessed. Lord help us all.

  359. Thanks Joe

    I agree

  360. I just finished reading Dutch Sheets letter. It is true that he never prophecized anything in regards to the 2008 Election. He does talk about his reservations about Obaama and his hopes for a McCain – Palin administration.

    I agree with Jacob on this point. It is about time! It is good to have a prophetic word that warns of judgment if there be no repentance. Did anyone notice that Dutch mainly chastize the Church for its lack of discernment and not standing up on moral issues?

    He also chastise people for voting on economic or just to make history. These people were voting to deal with racial injustice or to stop the killing of unborn babies. Finally, Dutch went after those who’d rather talk of nice things then actually fulfill the duties of the Prophet.

    He really didn’t talk about Obama, on a personal level.

  361. Yes, I agree with Barry and Jacob on this one.

    Of course, I want to hope that God will ‘use’ Obama for righteousness, but there is very little we really know of this man, and what we do have proof of (his past horrible people associations, his extreme liberal voting record) causes tremendous concern for myself, and other praying believers I know.

    Oh God may we be ready for the days ahead of us.

  362. That’s real righteousness Joe. You’ve chosen your side. God is not done with this yet. He will have his day to avenge to blood of the unborn, either in this life on in the hear after, though I do pray His mercy for people like you who have seem to have sold their soul to a spirit of death and have placed priority of the economy over real live human beings

    Give me a freaking break with your self righteousness. If Obama hates and kills babies, then why in the world does he have two kids of his own? People like you, jacob are so blinded by political bias that you fail to even acknowledge that just maybe God wanted Obama to win and is going to use him mightily. Dutch sheets can say anything he wants over this matter but his credibility concerning this issue in ZERO. I would rather listen to the prophet who TRULY heard from the Lord concerning this matter. Open your eyes barry, divine and Jacob.

  363. I can confidently say that the article Sheets wrote was purely based on emotions and the flesh.

  364. Btw, if you think voting for McCain was going to stop Abortion, then you are truly deceived.

  365. from elijahlist aug 16th 08


    “The level of confusion and deception I have seen over America in the last two years both in the Church and without has been unlike anything I have ever witnessed. The level of it, especially in the Body of Christ, has truly been shocking to me. The list of areas in which it has manifested is broad: presidential candidate endorsements and prophecies, doctrinal error, relational breakups, disagreements over what is true and false revival, etc.

    Add to this list a general weariness, complacency (one well-known leader told me he doesn’t think it matters anymore who is elected president – so much for shifting the Supreme Court!), disillusionment, disorientation, etc. – and it all adds up to incredible confusion and deception. I believe it is all linked to our war in Iraq, which is ancient Babylon. Babylon means “confusion.” It was not difficult for us to defeat Iraq’s physical army, but the principality – the spirit of Babylon – has been another story altogether.

    Just a couple of weeks ago, however, I heard the Holy Spirit say very clearly to me, “I’m about to unravel the cords of confusion.” When I heard this I had the sense that it would begin in September.

    In 2 Chronicles 20, God used Israel’s worship to “ambush” their enemies. The result was that these enemies destroyed one another! Expect the confusion to break off of the Church this fall and for God’s enemies to be ambushed.

    The November Elections

    To say it has been troubling to listen to prominent Christian leaders endorse certain candidates and/or prophesy that it is God’s will for those candidates to be president would be an understatement. Make no mistake about it, the turning of the Supreme Court and reversing the flow of death and anti-God laws that have flowed out of it is still God’s number one governmental agenda for America.

    To elect a pro-abortion candidate that would appoint pro-abortion judges would be disastrous and could set us back 50 years. It doesn’t matter who prophesies or states otherwise – don’t be deceived by this. It is NOT God’s will for us to have a liberal, pro-abortion president!

    I listened to one of the presidential candidates make a speech four years ago and heard one of the strongest abilities for deceiving and moving the masses that I’ve ever witnessed. The strength of this “gift” was very scary. I knew then he would be a candidate for president in ’08. The good news is that the deception surrounding him will begin to break in September and the momentum of the elections will be decided at that time – if the Church prays. Please pray diligently and don’t be taken in by charisma and empty promises of change.”

  366. Good review Kamster. You know, I’ve been involved in this thread now for sometime and there’s a mystery I have discovered. It seems everytime someone brings up the abortion issue, folks like Joe the brick layer either ignore or dodge the issue. What’s up with that? If there is anything clear about Obama it’s his extreme record on abortion. Here’s his record in detail which also includes being against banning partial birth abortion, or “scissors threw the skull and a hose sucking out the brains abortion” as it is most commonly known. Yes, sarcasm is my way of driving home the truth.

    Joe says we think Obama wants to kill babies. No, but it’s kind of like saying someones not a slave owner but they voted for slavery. I’m sure we will get the silent treatment or another verbal dance from Joe the brick layer though.

  367. Here is the amazing word that MOST people have seemed to ignore. Kim Clement said something that I ABSOLUTELY know is from the LORD. America may have it flaws, and there are many things that God will judge us on. But The USA is still a beacon of MUCH righteousness. It is the homebase for many great international ministries that are carrying out the work that Christ mandated in Matthew 28. We absolutely can not ignore that God’s hand is on this nation NOT just for judgement, but God will ABSOLUTELY Bless this nation in many incredible ways in the next few years. Does that make the prophet who proclaims this blessing False? God forbid. Will God judge us for the hundreds of thousands of young lives prematurely ended through abortion? Absolutely. Will God judge this nation for its’ leaning towards ungodly homosexual lifestyles? Absolutely. Anyone who paid attention this past summer would have noticed that there were 800 simultaneous fires not long after the time many homosexual couples were “married”. Jimmy Kimmel even made a reference to it in one of his monologues. But there is much more in God’s hands for America than just his Rod. He also has his Staff. There will be an outpouring of blessing on this nation in an economic sense just as Kim prophesied and most of the individuals who are posting on this page will live to see it.

  368. You are correct Mr. T.

    However, I must also add that my heart has shifted in this one area. I don’t want to hear anymore talk of outpourings, revivals, breakthroughs, levels of glory, Thus Saith the Lord’s or anything else without a real message of repentance along with it. As matter of fact, because America IS a beacon of righteousness, “To whom much is given, much is required.” (Luke 12:48) We need a real house cleaning in the prophetic and charismatic movement today. As of late, we have been more of a beacon of soft morality and anything goes christianity more than anything else. I’m not into endless repenting but we are in real dire straits right now in the body. Is it any wonder that stuff like the Lakeland junk was uncovered not long before the elections and now we are complaining about the choice America has made. Judgement starts in the household of God my friend. (1 Peter 4:17)

  369. It seems everytime someone brings up the abortion issue, folks like Joe the brick layer either ignore or dodge the issue. What’s up with that? If there is anything clear about Obama it’s his extreme record on abortion

    This is just silly, i disagree with Obama on abortion and gay marriage. That doesn’t mean that a vote for him meant i agree with those issues. Unlike you, i’m not going to vote republican year after year without any changes being made to stop abortion or gay marriage. You had Bush for eight long years and what happened?

    Once again, God is not narrowminded like some of you here and He has a plan for Barack Obama. You guys CAN’T seem to get it into your heads that GOD can use Obama. Last time i checked, God didn’t just use conservatives republicans to do his will.

    Dutch sheets is jumping the gun once again, he doesn’t know how God is going to use Obama but he claims Obama is going to be the death of this country. Me for one don’t give any attention to someone who had it soo wrong about the elections in the first place. I see the McCain supporters on here are totally ignoring the prophetic insights given by the prophet at I wonder why? Read his prophecies( Accurate i might add) and listen to the plans God has for Obama and this country. I feel sorry that you keep listening to the insights of partisan prophets who had it so wrong from the beginning.

  370. Btw, i see some of you guys didn’t have a problem with Guiliani, a pro-choice, gay marriage candidate winning the presidency. Even pat robertson endorsed him, is it because he had an R attached to his name?

  371. Excuse me. Joe. I have huge problems with Guiliani and would never vote for him. Now YOU have jumped the gun. I have huge problems with the republican party and came VERY close to going 3rd party this time around. Do you think God was narrow minded about slavery. Crickets Joe??? How about Nazism? More crickets Joe??? When it comes to certain sins known a “abominations” God is very narrow minded. I tell you what Joe. I’d like to see your list of priorities in how you vote and where issues like murder of the unborn would be on your list.


    Come on Joe, we’re waiting. What’s more important to you. Let’s see some guts Joe. What’s more important than a holocaust of 50 million babies? As far as Bush, what has he done in eight years? Try shifting the supreme court with two judges. Come on. Where’s the list? Do you have the guts to give us one?

  372. McCgreg, So you voted for Bush twice and babies are still being aborted right? Once again, You people are looking for a man made answer to a spiritual issue. Under whose administration where all these babies aborted? Obama’s administration?

    Btw, why are you people ignoring the prophecies by billionsoulsforchrist? Because it pains you to hear that God has a plan to use Obama for Good.

  373. The list Joe.

  374. billionsoulsforchrist? Great! Glorious! They look like a great ministry with accurate prophets. I’m not asking about prophets. billionsoulsforchrist? How ’bout “millions of babies in a dumpster”? Where’s your list Joe?

  375. Kim Clement has been prophesying about Obama all along. Just here him explain it today Nov 6 from his studio.

    McCain was never supposed to win. and Palin was never ready. Even Colin Powell said that and so did Pat Robertson.


    Sign Off: The election is over. I will not be visiting this thread again



  376. Kim clement was tryin to have it both ways all along. Sorry

  377. Oh irony of sweet irony!

    I have done some researches on the history of the two current parties. More recently, I was asking a simple question. Why are somany African Americans dedicated Democrats? What the heck did the Republicans do to alienate this group?

    These type of questions need to asked because it speaks of serious problems in the Republican Party. Instead of agonizing about conservatism, they need to answer some real question and repent of their own wickedness.

    It is very ironic that the Republican Party were used to stop slavery, civil right and equality. Yes, there were problems; however they did stand against a number of wickedness practiced by certain Democrats.

    With this in mind, I find it strange that RNC mainly consist of white men. This is in sharp contrast to the RNC of the early 1900s. Then, they were a party that were more open about supporting African American politicians.

    Yet, the “modern” RNC does not bother to aggressively cater to the African American community. They just leave them in the hands of the Democrats. They don’t think of the harm done by Southern Democrats who’ve came in with the goal of opposing civil right. and insist on State Rights. Powell was right to chastise the RNC for using him.

    I don’t think the current RNC is the party of Lincoln and the one who sided with LBJ. Something happened and they need to repent.

    I’ll deal with the Dems, later. Consider this, if they be racist then how is it that they supported Obama? As God does know the whole truth, is it possible that God is going to use Obama to deal with this problem?

  378. Watch the kim clement webcast broadcast yesterday. All you Obama haters will be enlightened.

  379. Joe,

    I just finished watching and it cuts both ways. 🙂 I did reread the Sept 5 ’08 and can see why Palin. One good key lesson is to be wary of presuppositions.

  380. I really have a hard time with Kim Clement. When I weigh the words that he says, they don’t add up, and you can easily see if McCain had won, Clement would likely have been saying, “See I knew it / foretold it all along” …

    The other check I have with Clement is the very high amount of times he asks for people to send in their money during his ‘broadcasts’ … I don’t have a problem with someone taking an offering, but he sprinkles it constantly throughout his words and ministry.

    Again, I’m not a Clement hater. I am trying to weigh him, and am having a difficult time confirming him as a reliable source.

    Regardless, Obama is the President, so I will be praying for him, even though the guy I voted for didn’t win.

  381. Thats what i was saying all along about Kim.

    joe, on November 4th, 2008 at 7:57 am Said:
    Divine, lol i watched some of it and he was VERY vague. I think he’s trying to have it both ways, so that when either of them wins, he can claim he prophecied it

  382. I was listening to some of the pundits on Fox. They made an interesting comment about Pres Elect Obama. The guy ran as a fiscal conservative –Republican.

    When I recalled the comment in Kim’s word about “He’s a Democrat who’s a Republican”. My eyebrow definitely went up. 🙂

    Talk about a prophetic word that can easily fit BOTH candidate. All we need is for Obama to nom Rudi to Homeland Security or something. I’m alluding to the bit about NYC.

  383. ^^Not going to happen. Remember rudy making fun of his community organizing job at the RNC?

  384. Now it begins.

    I can’t even begin to express the grief in my heart. All progress the pro-life movement has made in recent years is beginning to unravel, and Obama’s hasn’t even taken the oath of office yet. With sincere brokenness and humility I ask, please have mercy on our nation dear Jesus.

  385. I would encourage people to keep praying.

    While it is good to pray that God would deal with Obama’s heart on issues like abortion; it would be more effective to pray that the culture in the US be changed.

    Pray that a “culture of life” would replace the “culture of death”. Pray that the issues that causes a woman to seek an abortion to be dealt with. It doesn’t do any good to say Make abortion illegal and not do anything about the underlying problem. Abortion is often a reaction to what is going on.

    While watching the Call D.C., someone spoke of a curious scene. Thee was a young pregnant woman standing there confused. She desperatly needed help but didn’t know what to do. The woman was considering an abortion.

    Suddenly a mob of people came swooping in and snatched the baby from the woman. They raced off celebrating the rescue. However, the woman was left crying and broken. Her cries for help was left unanswered.

    It doesn no one any good to save the baby and not to help the mother who has to raise the baby. There are two lives at stake and not one.

  386. Cheer Up! There are several young GOP rising stars with Sarah Palin leading the pack. You may check out the list on this site at

  387. Kaiser,

    Thanks for the encouragement. I guess I’m just not in the GOP mood. We’ll just have to see. The secularists in the republican party are going to fight like mad against anyone associated with evangelical christians for the next four years. They just don’t get it. They’ll never win another election without us. You can’t out-left the left. Besides, while we just “wait” and “see” what will happen to the republicrats, more babies will die.

    They better make a quick and decisive move towards LIFE or the’re going to get left by the christian community. We’ll just find another vessel that actually beliefs what they preach. Both republicans and demorats are so overran with Jezebel, it may take a third party. Yeah, we may lose for a while but at least we won’t have sold our soul.

  388. They just don’t get it. They’ll never win another election without us. You can’t out-left the left. Besides, while we just “wait” and “see” what will happen to the republicrats, more babies will die.
    So i guess no babies died under regan, bush one and bush 2’s two terms in office.

  389. I said that I’d deal with the Democratic Party.

    It is amazing what I discovered when I looked up its original platform. It seems Thomas Jefferson has a view that is hauntingly similar to many social liberals. There is just one difference. Thomas Jefferson recognize saw these freedom as coming from God or Supreme Intelligence as he’d call God.

    It is also woth noting that the Democratic Party has a history of compromising on the wrong things. In the name of keeping the nation united; they were willing to let the South keep slavery. This is indeed a stench in God’s nostril.

    After the Civil War, they were opposed to including the 13th, 14th and 15th amendment to the Constitution. It is worth noting that many conservatives were in agreements with them. They, both Dems and conservatives were even opposed to the reparation plan of Lincoln and Johnson. The party just didn’t want to embrace some very needed changes.

    While it is great to learn the old Republicans stood up and passed an anti KKK bill, it is worth noting that Southern Democrats resisted such a bill. This wasn’t the only time.

    It seems that the Democratic Party has a sorry history with racism. It is very true that much stem from the inflences of the Old South. How ironic!

    Has anyone stopped to notice the irony in Obama winning the Election? Did anyone picked up on the symbolism of Obama winning Virginia? A state that was the starting point of the slave trade and where the capital of the Confederacy?

  390. Joe,

    You’re right Joe. However, the fate of Rowe vs. Wade lies in the hands of the supreme court and it is the presidents who pick the supreme court justices. So, wouldn’t it make sense to vote for a president that will pick supreme court justices that favor overturning rowe vs. wade or some variation? I am passionate about this issue and I would love it if God would used Obama to pick the right supreme court justices that would lead us to a culture of life again. I am greived that Obama’s abortion record is the exact opposite AND that past republicans have not turned the supreme court more quickly. All are at fault in their own way and the issue has been politicized for so long. It should be about a LIFE not a political strategy.

    I assume you are pro-life. So I ask you, what should we do? What is the next step to take? Do we say nothing, do nothing, vote for who or whatever? I am asking a sincere question with no spite. If you had a strategy as an American citizen and you deeply cared about the rights of the unborn, what would your strategy be? What would you do at this point as a citizen?

  391. Adoption cost thousands of dollars. If I wanted to adopt a baby, I’d have to give serious thought, as I’m poor. How many of us have the thousands needed. The same goes for the woman willing to give up the child for adoption.

    Why not support laws that would either subsidize the costs for the woman making such a sacrifice? Why not support a hospital drop off or unwanted babies. A financially stressed woman would come in, give birth and leave the child. She would not have to pay the huge medical cost.

    How about the churches getting involved in the foster care programs? How about running Christian adoption program? As it is, some churches are doing just that.

    If young women see that there is a real alternatives, they may well choose these option then abortion.

  392. Barry,

    You’re right! We should be pro-active on all fronts. It is compassion and the love of Jesus through His church that will ultimately change our culture. Of couse, this does not take the place of being an active citizen in the voting process but it must be coupled with acts of compassion.

  393. Jacob,

    You hit the nail on the head. We need to be pro active on all fronts.

  394. McGregor,

    Hey I feel you on repentance. Unfortunately, most of the time true repentance only takes place after judgement. It is very unfortunate that it takes disasters and great tragedies to occur before revival.

    Now here’s my real issue as I review some of the comments on this blog. Some somehow are under the impression that God is endorsing one party over the other. The truth is that the LORD is suspiciously biased towards his OWN laws which are consantly violated by ALL Americans on both “sides of the aisle”. Now I know there are people who regularly participate on this board who sincerely believe that the Republicans have somehow become morally superior on certain issues. Do your own research. There has been a HIGH degree of wickedness on BOTH sides. Obviously we’ve had a tremendous opportunity for some major moralistic changes to happen over the last 8 years or so. Have they happened?

    Now here’s an even bigger issue that is not being addressed up here. Are some of these moral issues we gripe about really resting in the hands of the elected officials? Or has the power and standard coming from many of our American pulpits been diminished by an extreme commercialism of the Gospel? Our Nation’s present moral depravity is more than a result of a liberal Democratic party as some would suggest. I can hear them now…”If only all those ungodly liberal Democrats would change their citizenship.” I submit to you that we have arrived at this point in our Nation because many (certainly not all) of those who have been called to Pastoral, prophetic, apostolic, evangelistic, and christian educational ministry have failed and fallen extremely short. What exactly do we take our Savior to mean when he declared “Ye are the salt of the Earth!..”?

    “My friends” as Sen. McCain would say…we must hold our elected officials accountable for their actions. However, there must be a greater level of accountability in the Church. I use the singular in spite of the multitude of denominations only because that was the prayer of our Savior according to John 17. God Bless you all.

  395. We need to Pray,Pray and Pray more, and Fast too.
    2 Chronicles says If my People which are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven and forgive their sins and heal their land. Admit it our Nation Needs Healing, the blood of unborn are on our hands and their blood cries out, did not Abels blood cry out!!! The Humanist groups have tried very hard to toss God out of our nation, But their is a remment, which is the Church and God is a Mighty God and ready to save, We need to be ready for the rapture which could take place soon, Jesus is coming soon Just accept the fact he died on the cross for your sins, and ask for forgiveness You are then a new creature in Christ, the bible say Old things are passed away Behold all things become new. Start reading the Bible God inspired word. Our road map for Life here on Earth, We need to be Christ like, So start in Matthew and analize the Life of Christ and follow him. I Love you and so does God dont ever think you have gone to far to be saved or forgiven. For all of us have fallen short Let God do the work in your life. Amen

  396. This thread has turned me off already with the irrational waste of times like Joe. The fact that people actually think the way he does is quite frustrating, to say the least. Wow! I just can’t believe how far away from reality someone can be!

    Kim Clement showed without a shadow of a doubt to be a false prophet. At least Hank Kunneman (another presumptous prophet) admitted on his website to being presumptous…but Kim Clement is completely ignoring his Giuliani and McCain prophecies and only quoting the Obama prophecies and only mentioning the emails that cater to “defending” him, instead of those who critique and honestly ask about the obvious “false” prophecies and/or going back and forths like the 2 prophecies pointing to Rudy Giuliani, then the 6 pointing to McCain/Palin and only touching the the 3 pointing to Obama…and ignoring the September ones erasing the doubts about the Obama ones.

    Kim Clement admitted to thinking it was McCain on Nov 6th. Now if the prophecies he was given about Obama were truly saying that Obama was the one….Kim would have not “thought” it was McCain.

    The truth was that Kim was going back and forth covering all of his tracks, as I had stated in the beginning of this thread.

    Now, Dutch Sheets is the most honest and most reliable source right now. He isn’t falling for the bait of the cheese….but he is laying out and keeping it real and telling it how it is.

    How people continue to irrationally see what they want and ignore(willingly in Joe’s case) what has taken place is eery.

    Again, just see the mob that voted to release Barrabas and wanted to “Crucify!” an innocent righteousness man instead…..and how the secular darwinists and those who spiritually are their puppets cry out: “Crucify!” our President who has fought for righteousness and mobbed a vote to unleash “Barakas Obama!” over what was morally right….is just beyond me.

    The lack of discernment and the fantasy world of some on this thread is quite distasteful to even hold a logical conversation. People like Joe is like talking to a dog or something…

  397. No one is talking it with more common sense and wisdom than Dutch Sheets right now. And Chuck Pierce is under Dutch Sheets, so they are in agreement.

    People like Joe, need to discern the difference between prophecying and “wishful thinking”….you don’t vote for someone because of a “wishful thought” that God will somehow change them into a different man…no, you vote for someone based on their track record.

    Selective hearing is what Joe is doing when it comes to pulling websites that will point to Obama being in God’s will (as if God’s will is for pedophiles to rape children), no all because something happens doesn’t make it God’s will. IF that were the case, then why would God give us the 10 Commandments? ???Hmm???

    No, stop with this selective hearing and wishful thinking and open up your eyes at reality.

    When someone proves without a shadow of a doubt that he was a presumptous fantasy island speaker (like Kim Clement has done)….you must act in wisdom and recognize that Dutch Sheets is speaking the truth and in the most wisdom here.

    Just like he called the Todd Bentley craze being so obviously exagerated and presumptous…..he is calling out the presumptous prophets…..

    Be real. Stop using selective hearing and be HONEST for once in your life.

  398. Finally, the reason the true Christians always vote Republican and “not” Democrat is pretty clear and pretty simple and elementary really, my dear Watson.

    Because they have been the Party that defends the “Bible”. They were the Party that BANNED SLAVERY, they were the Party that Dr MARTIN LUTHER KING JR “JOINED” (hello?), they have been the Party that has stood up against ABORTION, and the HOMOSEXUAL PROPOGANDA and MISINFORMATION, have fought for other Biblical principles including FREEDOM.

    Doesn’t mean that there aren’t a few bad apples. Of course, you have them everywhere!!! For anyone to nitpick on a bad apple is purely ridiculous to say the least.

    The Democrat Party is the Party that fought “AGAINST” banning slavery, AGAINST the BIBLE, AGAINST our FREEDOMS, and they are FOR ABORTION, DEGRADING THE FATHER, FOR the PROPOGANDA being spread by the HOMOSEXUAL MOVEMENT…etc.

    It’s quite simple really.

    Anyone who angrily opposes this truth is far from the truth.

    Just like the angry mob cried out: “BARABAS!, GIVE US BARABAS!”….and turned to Christ and cried out: “CRUCIFY HIM!”

    You see history “eerily” repeating itself! Yikes!

  399. Also to respond to another poster’s statement about that there are “two” parties involved, not just the baby, but the mother also? No, brother there are “3” parties involved a “FATHER” who will be forking the bill and the responsibility. Hello?

    A baby isn’t just a mother’s burden but a FATHER and MOTHER’s responsibility! Get it right, jack.

    Stop falling for the propoganda being spread by the media and our liberal biased public schools about the feminist movement (which is a demonic movement) that has risen to bring down the foundation of a family….THE FATHER!

  400. The WORD of God is the foremost authority! Period. Not Dutch Sheets and certainly NOT the Republican Party! Yahweh himself is the Authority.

    I Love what Daniel said when Nebuchadnezzar’s dream and it’s meaning were revealed to him.

    Daniel 2:20-22
    ” 20 Daniel answered and said, Blessed be the name of God for ever and ever: for wisdom and might are his: 21 And he changeth the times and the seasons: he removeth kings, and setteth up kings: he giveth wisdom unto the wise, and knowledge to them that know understanding: 22 He revealeth the deep and secret things: he knoweth what is in the darkness, and the light dwelleth with him. ”

    God ALWAYS has the last word. Nothing just happens by chance. Look at what Daniel said in verse 21 GOD(YAHWEH) removeth kings and setteth up kings. Now I know some of you are saying…”what does that have to do with elected officials?”. Well here’s the thing, our “elected” leaders are still being “set up” and “taken down”. That is a process that will continue until the return of our Lord. I will say this once again. Neither Party is morally superior right now in this nation. I know that Divine and others are sufficiently convinced that the all Republicans Go to Heaven, and vice versa all Democrats go to H#$5. However, this just is not the case. To equate Sen. John McCain to our Savior and Lord and to somehow equate President-Elect Barack Obama to the convicted criminal released by Pilate is just typical of the distorted view some Americans have in segments of this Nation. It is absolutely astounding that such communication could even come from the mouth of a “Christian”. First of all, as great a human being as John McCain is and even with all he endured as a P.O.W., he has NEVER endured nor is he qualified to be compared to what our LORD endured at Calvary. There has to be line we draw in using rhetoric in these discussions. Is Sen. McCain a great man to be admired, respected, revered, etc. Absolutely. He has served this Nation with dignity and honor without question. But Please…..Let’s stop acting like the Devil himself somehow just got into the White House. It Just NOT the Case! it’s absolutely NOT True. Is Obama going to be without flaws, shortcomings, and failures? ummmm….Obviously not. That the thing about being human. Why don’t we do what you should do for ANY leader including the ones you didn’t vote for_PRAY.

    Obviously, if Jesus taught us to Bless those who curse us and pray for those who despitefully use us, I’m sure he would want us to pray for our nation’s leadership.

    Let me say this as well. I am in no way saying that we shouldn’t respect Christian leaders such as Dutch Sheets. However, there is a danger when believers place higher credence on what come out of the mouth of these human beings and not what is the consensus of the canon of Biblical writings especially the words of our LORD. Whose Word created the Universe? By whose power are we even in existence? Is it Dutch Sheets and Kim Clement who made man in their image? Was it Billy Graham who said “Let there be light”? All I am saying is let God’s Word by true and may His Word be THE authority by which we are guided. Has the Republican Party gotten it right on some major moral issues? Absolutely. However, are their hands completely clean from the blood of the innocent? Have they always treated ALL Americans as equal human beings? All I’m saying is that in this game of political power, everybody has gotten their hands very dirty. Some have just been to hide it behind their nice “Christian Conservatism” But just keep watching. There is still some more “uncovering” coming up. A “few” bad apples doesn’t begin to describe it.

  401. “Doesn’t mean that there aren’t a few bad apples. Of course, you have them everywhere!!! For anyone to nitpick on a bad apple is purely ridiculous to say the least.”

    **Does a double take!**

    “Divine admits it! Finally!”

    This is correct; there are bad apples in BOTH parties. We should not act as if one is the party of “saints” and the other a party of “demons”. There are good and bad people in both parties.

    Place not your trusts in Republicanism but rather place your trusts in God, Alone!

  402. Divine,

    Until recently, you were an avid supporter of Kim Clement. You shot down anyone who disagreed with you by virtue of what Kim has said. Now, you’re doing a “backpedal”.

    Just acknowledge that you’re wrong. It is okay and it takes real humility. I, for one was wrong in both my readings of Kim’s statements and for leaning on Kim rather then seeking God.

    What of Dutch Sheets or Lou Engles? I read the letters that each men posted on their sites. Lou’s is in the Blog section.They really said the same thing; except I felt Lou did a better job.

    I don’t think either men claimed to be prophets. Lou is clearly a driven man and is correctly viewing the Election through that lens. I honestly felt that Lou spoke with God’s anointing.

    With Dutch, I felt that he wrote with more of a tone of anger. Nevertheless, Dutch is right about the poor level of discernment in the Church. It is caused by spirit of compromise.

    We blindly support the Republican Party but don’t keep them accountable. We blindly elect our favorite candidates and don’t bother to examine their character. “If they be a Republican, THEY MUST BE RIGHTEOUS! Surely they don’t need our prayers and letters.” Both are FALSE.

    For their sakes, the Church needs to be clear and needs to united. They need to look and see that the Church is not ambiguous and is ready to speak up on moral issues. They need the Church to speak up with solutions for the problems facing our nation. Many of them do care about this country. They can’t do it, alone!

    Who are “they”? We just put them into Congress, the Senate and the White House. I speak of our elected leaders.

    If we, the Church, are united then we’d be a real force. They need to see that we are supporting candidates who have good moral characters.

  403. excerpt of an April 4th prophecy by kim clement

    And they shall say, “but now there is a second President, how can we have two presidents?” An unusual thing, isn’t it, says the Spirit of the Lord? Why would it be that one with a double mind would stand up and face the people? No, they shall say “we have two presidents, what do we do now?”

    CNN COMMENTARY from 11/14

    Commentary: Why U.S. has two half-presidents

    Who is the president of the United States? The real president?

    Right now, the US may have two of them —

    HEADLINE of the new issue of the New Republic.

    The New Republic
    Two Presidents at a Time by The Editors

  404. The first time I ever heard of Kim was 2 months ago. My spirit was not at peace.

    Regarding his prophecies concerning future president:

    Obama picked the author of the book the ‘Grand Chessboard’ Zibigniew Zebrinski as his chief foreign advisor and Joe Biden as VP. These choices speaks volumes’.

    Knowledge-up on all fronts, apply wisdom, identify the players in the ‘global 7 mountain game’, then pray and serve as the Holy Spirit leads you.

    The available data on one front:

    Obama will be the next Commander and Chief of USA. Jesus exhorts us to honor the king regardless of our opinions or the truth hidden on the table before us.

    Now, do your part on the 7 mountains praying and serving.

  405. Inauguration Day sooooooooooooo sweet!!!!!!

    Just love our new President Elect

    O – B – A – M – A

  406. amen, Jamie! I have MUCH peace when i see that kim clement prophecies and weeks later, months later, even years later – it happens. sounds like someone hearing from God to me. further, he states that God has said that HE will turn obama’s heart like he turned saul’s heart. That gives me peace. A decent man, a Christian – now filled with the Holy Spirit and being led by the Holy Spirit. I’m feelin’ it, Jamie!

  407. Such a beautiful and wonderful day. A day that I thought I would never see. I have tears of JOY. I know that God’s Will will be done in this country that ‘s why He chose Barack Obama to be our President. The scripture says that God sets up kings and removes them.

    God chose President Barack Obama


  408. What do you selfish and immature Christians have to say now? Now that Barak Hussein Obama has sabotaged our country into a Socialist nation? Now that he signed a pork filled bill full of discrimination against Christians and $5.5billion to “ACORN”, the vote fraud organization? What do you dumb dumbs have to say now about Barak Hussein Obama?

  409. divine,

    your man lost. The Lord has raised up Barack Obama for such a time as this. The plan will work. We are not selfish and immature Christians. You are just bitter and personally I don’t think you have enough knowledge.

    You have said many thing to offend people on here. John McCain and Sara Palin would have been all wrong for this country. The Republicans are to blame for all this mess. 2 wars, bad economy, lies and being secret. Horrible leadership. Bush and the republicans sent our country to a literal hell in 8 years of corruption.

    Get Over it divine, please stay off of this site you offend people and you need to go once and for ALL

    divine, you are dumb, dumb and most of all IGNORANT. You probably are RACIST. Most white people are good. You are RACIST and white and a creep from hell

  410. divine you are not a Christan, so don’t lie and say that you are. you are from hell. a messenger from satan. Get off of here , PLEASEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

  411. Inform yourself before making a complete fool of yourself. Who the heck is “my” guy? My guy is Jesus Christ. You are against (anti) Jesus Christ. So you are of your father the devil.

    Study the truth instead of just echoing stupid lies from MSNBC, Saturday Night Live, and Keith “the liar” Olberman.

    George W. Bush grew more jobs than any other President in US history, 52 straight months and its highest GDP. That led to 2006, when the Democrats took control of Congress. Hello? Mcfly?

    Here’s evidence:

    The Democrat controlled Congress from 2006 and on stopped the record breaking 52 months of economic growth through not listening to President Bush’s policies and refusing to drill for oil which led to hiking gas prices to a record high. Then the Democratic run Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae lent loans to those who couldn’t pay them back and the economy collapsed. Learn before you talk. You make yourself sound like a 7 year old being duped by the media.

  412. If Obama is transformed by God into a righteous man, then I will support him to the fullest with happiness and praise. But I’m not for what he has been doing thus far….especially the hypocrisies! I tell it how it is.

    • i would say that ‘two presidents” represents Obama being a false president, and will fall by the wayside for his illegal campaign re: donations from acorn, an illegal organization; his non citizenship, and the illegal financinig of his campaign by George soros a non citizen.

      The second president will come after him, hopefully a republican when Obama is proven to be a non citizen by proving that his Kenyan birth certificate is the real one.

      Meanwhile you see him punishing this nation with communist mandates: I/E: govt forced access to your bank accounts for national health care; higher taxes, mandated smart cars (remember hitler and the Volks wagon), wealth redistribution…etc., until he is out of office.
      This is for allowing same sex relations to be accepted as normal and then legqalized, & likewise for the legalization and UN mandated global distribution of abortion.
      Remember California mandated fetal stem cell research & now has record brush fires & mandated smart meters in homes=govt control of your life.

  413. It sounds like people need to start testing these prophecies with God’s word. It sounds like people are willing to twist words until it matches their reality. Think about it: You went from Rudy Giulani to Barack Obama in only as many posts at it took to justify the results of the election with the prophecies. What about the Word of God?!
    I believe in prophecies and the prophetic word, but I also believe in testing prophecy, not with the outcomes as we perceive them, but with the truth of God’s Word. We fail greatly when we allow our ears to be tickled into any fashion like this. Aren’t you ashamed of yourselves?

  414. Hey Bryan, you say you believe in prophecies and the prophetic word, but that you believe in testing prophecy with a prophecy. Huh? You believe in prophetic words, but we need to test them with prophetic words? Doesn’t make sense.

    The Law of Moses says you test prophecy by, “If what a prophet says comes to pass…” You can’t say, I’m not believing say prophet TB Joshua, but I’m believing Daniel. That’s picking and choosing.

    The reason we believe Daniel, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Jesus (the Son of God), Paul, Peter, etc…is for the same reasons we believed in Moses…”There prophecies came to pass…”

    Kim Clement is not to be feared, since his prophecies are untrustworthy, not because they do or don’t fit with other prophets’ prophecies.

    Nostradamus was not a prophet, yet he would take prophecies from other prophets and repeat them and take credit for them. Didn’t make him true.

    All because a prophet’s prophecies match with the Bible, doesn’t make them of God. What makes the “Bible’s prophets” legit was that their prophecies came to pass and/or had ‘true’ signs and wonders accompanied by them. That’s what Moses “the giver of the Torah” said.

    So be ware of those prophets who (as Satan in the garden and in the wilderness with Christ Jesus) use the Word of God to convince people that their prophecies are of God. If that were the case, then what Satan told Christ about throwing himself off the building would have been ‘of God’. But it wasn’t.

    Too many ministries use that statement to make/control people’s beliefs and confidence. Its DEAD WRONG.

    You don’t prove prophecy with another prophecy. Its with does it come to pass. Now, yes, you can ‘to an extent’, use the Bible to test prophecy, again, ‘to an extent’, because the Bible prophets were proven prophets and their prophecies came to pass to prove that. But pass a certain extent….even Satan can use a prophecy in the Bible to match his false prophecy.

    Satan’s prophecies don’t come to pass, that’s why they are false. He can only decieve you into fulfilling his deceptive prophecy yourself. God’s are proven by them coming to pass, no matter what. Unless, God gives a condition ‘at the prophecy’ which is more of a warning than a prophecy anyways.

    Let’s get our facts straight people. And for those who are blindly following Barakas Obama? Sad….very sad…

    Alan Keyes would have been the best choice. But it seems that God’s will wasn’t in America’s agenda anyways… 😦

  415. Funny hwo everyone on here are christians, yet cussing each othe out like everyone else. weird

    • just because a mouse lives in a cookie jar doesn’t make it a cookie (from The Hiding Place)…just because someone says they are a Christian does not necessarily make it so. THe bible says you will know them by their fruit. The fruits of the Spirit are love, joy, peace. patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness and self-control. Also false prophets cannot acknowledge jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior, and that God came to this world as a man. He was God and man.

  416. WOW I thought my point of view was limited but after reading the other comments it the bloggers who’s views are limited.

  417. Everyone’s view is limited, royalty free beats, who’s isn’t? only way one’s view is limitless is if one was God. that statement you made about limited views is asinine and nonsensical.

  418. […] Like Bryan Fischer of the American Family Association, the Benefiels, blame the country’s political problems on the District of Columbia’s supposedly pagan foundations. Following in the footsteps of Benefiel, Cindy Jacobs and husband Mike (a coadjutor in her ministry) of Generals International has a unique record of misstatements, erroneous citations, and total lack of knowledge of hermeneutics and ontology. Like the prophetesses who served as Oracles for the ancient gods, especially at Delphi, Cindy Jacobs claims to have a direct link with her god. This deity, a male, gave her, Kim Clement (who received a surprising and not publicly released personal message from god on February 10, 2007, while in Scottsdale, AZ, for her god told her that the next president of the USA would be male, and according to the published prophecy, this male who will take office in 2008 will find a closeness with god and surprise everyone, for, according to the prophet Kim Clement: […]

  419. Awesome issues here. I am very glad to peer your article. Thank you so much and I’m looking forward to touch you. Will you kindly drop me a mail?

  420. We have a monster for a president now and people are scared of him,so let’s prophesise on the now thanks to the obama crap we are at a loss,keep God as close to our hearts as we can and pray that he comes soon. Or that obama gets impeached,and someone who knows what the hell they are doing steps up and gets voted as the president,not only this but we the ppl need to make stipulations that the pesident can’t have total control of things like obama has done. We the ppl need to fight for our rights.

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